Poll

How did the money arrive on Tena Bar

River Flooding
1 (5%)
Floated to it's resting spot via Columbia river
2 (10%)
Planted
6 (30%)
Dredge
11 (55%)
tossed in the river in a paper bag
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 17

Voting closed: August 16, 2016, 09:05:28 AM

Author Topic: Tena Bar Money Find  (Read 1434405 times)

Offline andrade1812

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #720 on: February 27, 2015, 03:38:30 PM »
Wikipedia.... heh.
 

georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #721 on: February 27, 2015, 03:57:36 PM »
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Wikipedia.... heh.

I havent the faintest idea what you are saying.

I do know this, the problem with Wiki these days is every jackass with an agenda (like Blevins) has been to Wikipedia and changed the content there multiple times, to slant things toward their agenda. Blevins even admitted he had done this and is proud of it!

I know one person who went to Wiki and spent some time there trying to separate facts from myth .... and no sooner did he spend the time trying to improve the article at Wiki, Blevins went right in the next day and changed things again. The person nailed Blevins at Dropzone for doing this. Blevins made some snide remark and wouldn't address the issue further. The person had had enough of Blevins and left Dropzone, which was fine with Blevins!
 

 


   
« Last Edit: February 27, 2015, 04:06:53 PM by georger »
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #722 on: February 27, 2015, 09:43:22 PM »
It is my understanding that Andy Anderson was in the cockpit as flight engineer for the dummy sled test. I don't know was flying the plane, but I don't think it was Scotty. (p. 129, Skyjack.)
 

Offline andrade1812

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #723 on: February 27, 2015, 11:45:52 PM »
My question thus remains, what kind of documentation is there of the 727 sled test? Is it all secondary sources or is there an actual report somewhere?
 

georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #724 on: February 27, 2015, 11:49:26 PM »
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My question thus remains, what kind of documentation is there of the 727 sled test? Is it all secondary sources or is there an actual report somewhere?

Oooops!

We have categories/threads of discussion here. This discussion box is the Tena Bar Money box.
At the subject line it says: Tina Bar Money Find
« Last Edit: February 27, 2015, 11:50:11 PM by georger »
 

georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #725 on: February 28, 2015, 02:19:49 AM »
"Brian found money in a clump, ... with pieces of money above where the bundle was found."

JT posted this on March 10, 2009. Snowmman and others responded immediately becoming a running discussion about the money find. Tom Kaye was present but never responded.

The full Thomas post is below. This confirms the Schreuder hypothesis that fragments on the surface is what lead to the Ingram find! It confirms the existence of fragments. It confirms comments about the find that Ingram made to me. So... winning the lottery, spooky action at a distance, super-sleuthing by Maldfum-Fornax trained specialists, and other forms of weirdness are no longer required to explain the simple fact of a family finding old cash on a sandbar. It is a triumph of science over secrecy and wizardry!

JerryThomas

Mar 10, 2009, 10:53 AM
Post #8722 of 57540 (51728 views)
    Re: [georger] Tom K.: I think only radar should be used [In reply to]
________________________________________
In looking at the photo's the dredging materal was deposited beyond the tree line.The sand and water seeped down somewhat like a land slide and formed the beach.Fazio stated that they took large dredge pipes and placed them on shore then pumped the material on shore.He also stated that the propelers on the pump would tear anything apart, and that when Brian found the money it was clumped together.However he also stated that there was pieces of money scattered above where the bundle was found along with other debris that had been washed ashore. I would also like to add that Toms GPS location of where brian found the money was close to the exact location that Brian remembered finding it.There was one major problem with the GPS though. Tom kinda forgets where he lays it down.
 

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« Last Edit: February 28, 2015, 02:44:25 AM by georger »
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #726 on: March 13, 2015, 10:17:37 PM »
Is there anyone here than believes the money found on Tina Bar was a plant, and why, or how would you come to this conclusion.
 

Offline nmiwrecks

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #727 on: March 13, 2015, 10:37:40 PM »
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Is there anyone here than believes the money found on Tina Bar was a plant, and why, or how would you come to this conclusion.
Saying the money was planted is the equivalent to finding an arrow and painting a bulls-eye around it.  I still haven't heard of a reasonable motive for planting the money.  My feelings are the money reached the location it was discovered in by erosion of dredge piles.  Sometimes, the easiest solution is the correct one.
I think the question is answered differently depending which camp you are in.  The "died jumping" crowd says "not planted", the "survived the jump" crowd says it was planted.  Not being able to prove either position leads to conjecture.  What are your thoughts?
"If you always do what you’ve always done, you’ll always get what you’ve always got." - Henry Ford
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #728 on: March 13, 2015, 10:50:44 PM »
I don't believe a plant either. it doesn't make any sense. there seems to be a lot more people believing a plant vs natural means. Brian said on national television that they were all stuck together, like a petrified piece of wood. The FBI claims the bundles were not stuck together?

I made a reference of them being compressed, and it appears the FBI agree's with that. I found that on one of Carr's comments on DZ. I don't mean compressed by excessive pressure, but enough to allow over time to become one. being in the bag with it tied by Cooper would appear to allow them to remain in that stage for a long period becoming fused together. if the dredge disrupted the bag, it's possible a few escaped from being shredded. I would still like another opinion from a dredge company.

I could be way off base, but that's the best way to find out.
 

Offline smokin99

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #729 on: March 13, 2015, 11:21:43 PM »
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Is there anyone here than believes the money found on Tina Bar was a plant, and why, or how would you come to this conclusion.

I tend more towards dredging - because I think that is one method that explains a lot -- and, even with all the ifs, ands, and buts, no one that I know of has been able to successfully and definitively counter the dredging argument.

No one yet has been able to explain planting in any way that makes sense. To me, Duane throwing it off the bridge makes more sense than a purposeful plant.
 

Offline smokin99

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #730 on: March 13, 2015, 11:25:08 PM »
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Is there anyone here than believes the money found on Tina Bar was a plant, and why, or how would you come to this conclusion.

I tend more towards dredging - because I think that is one method that explains a lot -- and, even with all the ifs, ands, and buts, no one that I know of has been able to successfully and definitively counter the dredging argument.

No one yet has been able to explain planting in any way that makes sense. To me, Duane throwing it off the bridge makes more sense than a purposeful plant.

Plus the dredge theory is not dependent on Cooper not making it or not making it - if he didn't die, he just didn't get to keep all of the money.
 

Offline smokin99

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #731 on: March 13, 2015, 11:29:41 PM »
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I don't believe a plant either. it doesn't make any sense. there seems to be a lot more people believing a plant vs natural means. Brian said on national television that they were all stuck together, like a petrified piece of wood. The FBI claims the bundles were not stuck together?

I made a reference of them being compressed, and it appears the FBI agree's with that. I found that on one of Carr's comments on DZ. I don't mean compressed by excessive pressure, but enough to allow over time to become one. being in the bag with it tied by Cooper would appear to allow them to remain in that stage for a long period becoming fused together. if the dredge disrupted the bag, it's possible a few escaped from being shredded. I would still like another opinion from a dredge company.

I could be way off base, but that's the best way to find out.

And it would help to know what kind of dredge. I remember when this has been discussed in the past, there was quite a bit of research but I don't think anyone ever definitively found out which dredging operation or type it was - just what was commonly used in the area maybe. I do know we were able to find pictures of dredging spoils with stuff going through and coming out reasonably intact. 
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #732 on: March 13, 2015, 11:56:58 PM »
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I don't believe a plant either. it doesn't make any sense. there seems to be a lot more people believing a plant vs natural means. Brian said on national television that they were all stuck together, like a petrified piece of wood. The FBI claims the bundles were not stuck together?

I made a reference of them being compressed, and it appears the FBI agree's with that. I found that on one of Carr's comments on DZ. I don't mean compressed by excessive pressure, but enough to allow over time to become one. being in the bag with it tied by Cooper would appear to allow them to remain in that stage for a long period becoming fused together. if the dredge disrupted the bag, it's possible a few escaped from being shredded. I would still like another opinion from a dredge company.

I could be way off base, but that's the best way to find out.

And it would help to know what kind of dredge. I remember when this has been discussed in the past, there was quite a bit of research but I don't think anyone ever definitively found out which dredging operation or type it was - just what was commonly used in the area maybe. I do know we were able to find pictures of dredging spoils with stuff going through and coming out reasonably intact.

I believe the FBI did speak with the Army Of Engineer's who did the dredging, but as you mentioned a lot of research went into the operation. plenty of objects clearly get through the dredge pump that contradicts the FBI's claim. one being 60 feet of chain going through the pump, and a cannonball  ;D

The money was wet, and would react a little different than metal, or a solid object, no?

I think snow found the correct dredge used. my head is not on straight tonight, but I did look into it. the head turns at a slow rpm, and has suction to pull the material up and into the pump. if it shredded the money. it appears the pump would do that vs the head, or the bit?

I still can't say what happened, or how it got onto Tina Bar?  :-\
« Last Edit: March 13, 2015, 11:57:45 PM by shutter »
 

georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #733 on: March 14, 2015, 12:10:06 AM »
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Is there anyone here than believes the money found on Tina Bar was a plant, and why, or how would you come to this conclusion.

I tend more towards dredging - because I think that is one method that explains a lot -- and, even with all the ifs, ands, and buts, no one that I know of has been able to successfully and definitively counter the dredging argument.

No one yet has been able to explain planting in any way that makes sense. To me, Duane throwing it off the bridge makes more sense than a purposeful plant.

Im not sure past posts settled questions about this dredging process itself. Was bottom sediment sucked off the bottom then deposited directly on Tina's Bar, or was it placed in a holding tank first before pumping?  Or does it even matter? The dredging company reported (to the FBI) they were confident nothing could have escaped the auger in this dredge. Snowmman thought he had found exceptions to this rule?

If I recall correctly, this dredge pumped directly onto the beach. No holding tank. Thus, there was a lot of water passing with sediment, a lot of sediment slide back into the water (see large bumps showing this in the 1974 USGS photos), the Fazio's had to wait several several days to a week for the material to settle and dry before they could spread, ... so a holding tank was not involved in this operation.

So let's say the dredge destroys say 95-97% of of the total bag of bundles. That leaves something less than $10k dollars, several bundles. The total waste is then pumped onto the bar, and spread by tractor. That might result in a few bundles grouped at one site with a debris field of fragments nearby? Why then are no fragments or the Ingram find noticed as soon as the new waste settles out and people are using the bar again... daily?

What we need is something that positively connects the money to the dredge sediment itself, that was put on Tina Bar. That identification could depend on forensic chemistry.

The question I have about a dredging theory is: how does the moneybag become a part of the bottom sediment off Tina's Bar, to be dredged in 1974? And if you consider bundles alone vs the whole bag of money, the question is even more problematic. But, a dredging and spreading scenario could explain the morphology of the money find.. if you include a debris field.

A plant theory requires a conspiracy and actors, almost inevitably, imho.

No explanation to date seems simple and connected to basic facts like the flight path. That imo is where the problem is.

 



 
« Last Edit: March 14, 2015, 12:22:16 AM by georger »
 

Offline nmiwrecks

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #734 on: March 14, 2015, 12:17:05 AM »
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Is there anyone here than believes the money found on Tina Bar was a plant, and why, or how would you come to this conclusion.

I tend more towards dredging - because I think that is one method that explains a lot -- and, even with all the ifs, ands, and buts, no one that I know of has been able to successfully and definitively counter the dredging argument.

No one yet has been able to explain planting in any way that makes sense. To me, Duane throwing it off the bridge makes more sense than a purposeful plant.

Plus the dredge theory is not dependent on Cooper not making it or not making it - if he didn't die, he just didn't get to keep all of the money.

that's a very good point.
"If you always do what you’ve always done, you’ll always get what you’ve always got." - Henry Ford