Poll

How did the money arrive on Tena Bar

River Flooding
1 (5%)
Floated to it's resting spot via Columbia river
2 (10%)
Planted
6 (30%)
Dredge
11 (55%)
tossed in the river in a paper bag
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 17

Voting closed: August 16, 2016, 09:05:28 AM

Author Topic: Tena Bar Money Find  (Read 1550706 times)

Offline EU

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Re: Tena Bar Money Find
« Reply #6210 on: August 10, 2021, 12:33:34 AM »
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The difference is sand that is completely submerged underwater and therefore soft and more permeable versus sand that is dry and compacted.

I don't believe that's accurate. After all, walk in water along the beach that is submerged...not exactly like quick sand.

Moreover, Tom's research showed that the process of agitation at the leading edge of the tide is abrasive and would therefore shatter the diatoms. This, of course, was not the case with the diatoms Tom discovered--i.e., shattered.

The bills were simply submerged in the spring river water, then buried.
Eric, do you believe the money was buried in the bag?

I believe the hole contained  the money bag, which held the majority of the ransom, and several loose straps of twenties. Moreover, that when DBC retrieved the money at night while the spot was under water during the June 1972 flooding event, three of the straps were inadvertently left behind in the hole and reburied.
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Offline georger

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Re: Tena Bar Money Find
« Reply #6211 on: August 10, 2021, 12:38:55 AM »
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The difference is sand that is completely submerged underwater and therefore soft and more permeable versus sand that is dry and compacted.

I don't believe that's accurate. After all, walk in water along the beach that is submerged...not exactly like quick sand.

Moreover, Tom's research showed that the process of agitation at the leading edge of the tide is abrasive and would therefore shatter the diatoms. This, of course, was not the case with the diatoms Tom discovered--i.e., shattered.

The bills were simply submerged in the spring river water, then buried.
Eric, do you believe the money was buried in the bag?

I believe the hole contained  the money bag, which held the majority of the ransom, and several loose straps of twenties. Moreover, that when DBC retrieved the money at night while the spot was under water during the June 1972 flooding event, three of the straps were inadvertently left behind in the hole and reburied.

All at night ?  ........... I headed for the Western Channel to catch the rest! 
 

Offline Unsurelock

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Re: Tena Bar Money Find
« Reply #6212 on: August 10, 2021, 12:41:47 AM »
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The difference is sand that is completely submerged underwater and therefore soft and more permeable versus sand that is dry and compacted.

I don't believe that's accurate. After all, walk in water along the beach that is submerged...not exactly like quick sand.

Moreover, Tom's research showed that the process of agitation at the leading edge of the tide is abrasive and would therefore shatter the diatoms. This, of course, was not the case with the diatoms Tom discovered--i.e., shattered.

The bills were simply submerged in the spring river water, then buried.

You can't expect "accurate." How did the bag get wet? Want to start with infinite Coopers and infinite possibilities? Then let's stay general. We're looking for a late Fall drop and a Spring dunk for the water. The cash had to stay together for about 4 months, undetected, then get wet and buried. Did the cash get dirty? Were there rotting remains in contact with it? Did it need to be cleaned off?

Those details come later. First you look for a force that will move money in the Spring in a way that introduces it to the Columbia and then buries it. The Washougal washdown partially fits, and human hands also fit.

Be sure to forget the fact of dredging. Forgetting that is essential to all other harebrained meanderings of the maldum fornax.

I will.
 
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Offline Unsurelock

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Re: Tena Bar Money Find
« Reply #6213 on: August 10, 2021, 12:47:38 AM »
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The difference is sand that is completely submerged underwater and therefore soft and more permeable versus sand that is dry and compacted.

I don't believe that's accurate. After all, walk in water along the beach that is submerged...not exactly like quick sand.

Moreover, Tom's research showed that the process of agitation at the leading edge of the tide is abrasive and would therefore shatter the diatoms. This, of course, was not the case with the diatoms Tom discovered--i.e., shattered.

The bills were simply submerged in the spring river water, then buried.

You can't expect "accurate." How did the bag get wet? Want to start with infinite Coopers and infinite possibilities? Then let's stay general. We're looking for a late Fall drop and a Spring dunk for the water. The cash had to stay together for about 4 months, undetected, then get wet and buried. Did the cash get dirty? Were there rotting remains in contact with it? Did it need to be cleaned off?

Those details come later. First you look for a force that will move money in the Spring in a way that introduces it to the Columbia and then buries it. The Washougal washdown partially fits, and human hands also fit.

Be sure to forget the fact of dredging. Forgetting that is essential to all other harebrained meanderings of the maldum fornax.

Be sure to forget physics. That is essential to thinking a giant water-spouting wood chipper mulched all of the bills into tiny fragments except for three perfectly stacked packets that landed perfrftly atop one another like flapjacks in a Tom & Jerry cartoon and only then slowly decayed uniformly around the bills while the rest was at all different depths in the sand.

Or let's both forget each other, whaddya say?
 
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Offline Chaucer

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Re: Tena Bar Money Find
« Reply #6214 on: August 10, 2021, 12:57:15 AM »
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The difference is sand that is completely submerged underwater and therefore soft and more permeable versus sand that is dry and compacted.

I don't believe that's accurate. After all, walk in water along the beach that is submerged...not exactly like quick sand.

Moreover, Tom's research showed that the process of agitation at the leading edge of the tide is abrasive and would therefore shatter the diatoms. This, of course, was not the case with the diatoms Tom discovered--i.e., shattered.

The bills were simply submerged in the spring river water, then buried.
Eric, do you believe the money was buried in the bag?

I believe the hole contained  the money bag, which held the majority of the ransom, and several loose straps of twenties. Moreover, that when DBC retrieved the money at night while the spot was under water during the June 1972 flooding event, three of the straps were inadvertently left behind in the hole and reburied.
Wouldn’t the same diatom destruction apply in your scenario?
“Completely unhinged”
 

Offline EU

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Re: Tena Bar Money Find
« Reply #6215 on: August 10, 2021, 01:05:04 AM »
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Wouldn’t the same diatom destruction apply in your scenario?

Not at all because Cooper would pull the bag from its watery grave and collect loose straps from the same hole while the water is a foot or two deep. Then, the three straps that are left behind are simply covered by the underwater sand back-filling the hole. Of course, the river eventually recedes and the rest is history.
Some men see things as they are, and ask why? I dream of things that never were, and ask why not?

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Offline Chaucer

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Re: Tena Bar Money Find
« Reply #6216 on: August 10, 2021, 01:28:19 AM »
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Wouldn’t the same diatom destruction apply in your scenario?

Not at all because Cooper would pull the bag from its watery grave and collect loose straps from the same hole while the water is a foot or two deep. Then, the three straps that are left behind are simply covered by the underwater sand back-filling the hole. Of course, the river eventually recedes and the rest is history.
OK, fair…but…that isn’t dissimilar to my scenario in which the money remains in the bag on on the riverbank until the spring, then rides the flood waters atop river debris to Tena Bar. The bag eventually opens, and some of the money spills out in the water where it fans out before being buried in the loose sand. The remaining money is washed away forever downstream. The only difference between your scenario and mine is how the money arrived on Tena Bar. It would be buried in similar fashion and therefore have similar diatom circumstances.
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Offline Robert99

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Re: Tena Bar Money Find
« Reply #6217 on: August 10, 2021, 01:50:46 AM »
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The difference is sand that is completely submerged underwater and therefore soft and more permeable versus sand that is dry and compacted.

I don't know what sand does in Florida, but at Tena Bar the sand adjacent to the water that is wet is very compacted while the dry sand further up the side of the river is extremely loose and difficult to walk in.
 

Offline Chaucer

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Re: Tena Bar Money Find
« Reply #6218 on: August 10, 2021, 02:05:19 AM »
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The difference is sand that is completely submerged underwater and therefore soft and more permeable versus sand that is dry and compacted.

I don't know what sand does in Florida, but at Tena Bar the sand adjacent to the water that is wet is very compacted while the dry sand further up the side of the river is extremely loose and difficult to walk in.
I fail to see the sense or relevance of this statement.
“Completely unhinged”
 

Offline Robert99

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Re: Tena Bar Money Find
« Reply #6219 on: August 10, 2021, 02:20:31 AM »
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The difference is sand that is completely submerged underwater and therefore soft and more permeable versus sand that is dry and compacted.

I don't know what sand does in Florida, but at Tena Bar the sand adjacent to the water that is wet is very compacted while the dry sand further up the side of the river is extremely loose and difficult to walk in.
I fail to see the sense or relevance of this statement.

Translating from the Greek, wet sand is compacted and dry sand is loose.  Further, don't mistake mud underwater as being sand.
 

Offline Chaucer

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Re: Tena Bar Money Find
« Reply #6220 on: August 10, 2021, 02:58:58 AM »
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The difference is sand that is completely submerged underwater and therefore soft and more permeable versus sand that is dry and compacted.

I don't know what sand does in Florida, but at Tena Bar the sand adjacent to the water that is wet is very compacted while the dry sand further up the side of the river is extremely loose and difficult to walk in.
I fail to see the sense or relevance of this statement.

Translating from the Greek, wet sand is compacted and dry sand is loose.  Further, don't mistake mud underwater as being sand.
I’m not an expert in sand, but my guess is that your statement depends on the type of sand, the permeability of the sand, and the coarseness of the sand, not to mention the movement of the water above it.
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Offline Kermit

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Re: Tena Bar Money Find
« Reply #6221 on: August 10, 2021, 01:23:58 PM »
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Kerm, if you had just landed with $200,000 in a bag, what would you do with it?
Big If ! LOL.
IF I landed in the middle of the Columbia River, I guess I’d just bury it right there !
Seriously it would largely depend upon where I landed but most everywhere in Washington and Oregon there are lots of brush and blackberries where even a rabbit wouldn’t go ! I definitely wouldn’t bury it in the sand at a widely popular fishing beach.
 

Offline georger

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Re: Tena Bar Money Find
« Reply #6222 on: August 10, 2021, 01:38:26 PM »
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Kerm, if you had just landed with $200,000 in a bag, what would you do with it?
Big If ! LOL.
IF I landed in the middle of the Columbia River, I guess I’d just bury it right there !
Seriously it would largely depend upon where I landed but most everywhere in Washington and Oregon there are lots of brush and blackberries where even a rabbit wouldn’t go ! I definitely wouldn’t bury it in the sand at a widely popular fishing beach.

Here is where Eric is and what he is doing. The digging is hard to impossible where he chose. He's in an area where there was fill work done - large rocks. When was that fill work done and by whom - what year? If the fill rocks were in place in 1972 then Eric is digging in a place where neither Cooper or God could have buried anything! Just sayin -
 


« Last Edit: August 10, 2021, 02:02:19 PM by georger »
 

Offline Chaucer

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Re: Tena Bar Money Find
« Reply #6223 on: August 10, 2021, 02:10:20 PM »
I'm more impressed that Cooper, a middle-aged man like myself, skydived from a jet, humped it 12 miles with a 20 lbs bag of money and then dug a deep enough hole in the sand with his bare hands - all in one night.

I get tired mowing the lawn.  :rofl:
« Last Edit: August 10, 2021, 04:00:38 PM by Chaucer »
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Offline EU

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Re: Tena Bar Money Find
« Reply #6224 on: August 10, 2021, 02:36:15 PM »
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Kerm, if you had just landed with $200,000 in a bag, what would you do with it?
Big If ! LOL.
IF I landed in the middle of the Columbia River, I guess I’d just bury it right there !
Seriously it would largely depend upon where I landed but most everywhere in Washington and Oregon there are lots of brush and blackberries where even a rabbit wouldn’t go ! I definitely wouldn’t bury it in the sand at a widely popular fishing beach.

Here is where Eric is and what he is doing. The digging is hard to impossible where he chose. He's in an area where there was fill work done - large rocks. When was that fill work done and by whom - what year? If the fill rocks were in place in 1972 then Eric is digging in a place where neither Cooper or God could have buried anything! Just sayin -
 




It appears this area was shored up with a boulder retaining wall and a top layer (2 feet thick) of very hard dirt and rock in 2011. This was done by the property owners directly north of the Fazios. Even though, this portion is on Fazio property.
Some men see things as they are, and ask why? I dream of things that never were, and ask why not?

RFK