Poll

How did the money arrive on Tena Bar

River Flooding
1 (5%)
Floated to it's resting spot via Columbia river
2 (10%)
Planted
6 (30%)
Dredge
11 (55%)
tossed in the river in a paper bag
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 17

Voting closed: August 16, 2016, 09:05:28 AM

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Author Topic: Tena Bar Money Find  (Read 1558486 times)

Offline georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5205 on: August 23, 2020, 02:03:48 PM »
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Fly just posted an article surround the dredging. Palmer didn't identify the layer, the Army corps. did. I seem to recall read that long ago.

Now, is the Army Corps. wrong like Palmer was thought to be. how did so much material get above the tideline?

Who at the Corps of Engineers?  I have never seen any document indicating that. Has Tom?
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Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5206 on: August 23, 2020, 02:06:39 PM »
I seem to recall reading that years ago but can't be certain....

I did find a tide chart for Feb 11, 1980...sunset was 5:31pm.
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Offline EU

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5207 on: August 23, 2020, 02:17:23 PM »
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I seem to recall reading that years ago but can't be certain....

I did find a tide chart for Feb 11, 1980...sunset was 5:31pm.

This doesn't seem right to me. If I'm understanding this correctly, you're saying that the river fluctuates 7 feet over the course of several hours? I don't think so.

I just looked up Lincoln City, OR which is right on the ocean and the fluctuation is 6 feet. The Columbia River is well above sea level. How could it possibly experience moon tides of 7 feet? Why then wouldn't a lake experience the same thing? No way.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2020, 02:21:01 PM by EU »
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Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5208 on: August 23, 2020, 02:22:50 PM »
8.43 is what they state...8.7 on the 12th...

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Offline georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5209 on: August 23, 2020, 02:23:04 PM »
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Fly just posted an article surround the dredging. Palmer didn't identify the layer, the Army corps. did. I seem to recall read that long ago.

Now, is the Army Corps. wrong like Palmer was thought to be. how did so much material get above the tideline?

Fly is jumping to conclusions again, missinterpretation of a NEWSPAPER article! The article is flat out wrong! Just forget what Fly is saying - he's wrong and jumping to conclusions again. His zeal to compete with Eric is overpowering his judgement and fact!

The only mention of the USGE in the Palmer report is this passage:

"Based on U.S. Corps of Engineering records which reflect they dredged the Columbia River at this site in 1974, Professor PALMER stated this clay layer in all probability, was deposited during that 1974 dredging...."

It is Palmer alone who made all identifications of strata. Period!  As far as I know no named USCE person was even at the excavation ? Palmer was the only geologist there. 

 
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Offline georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5210 on: August 23, 2020, 02:23:58 PM »
I will leave and let EU play . . . later.
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Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5211 on: August 23, 2020, 02:32:13 PM »
Toss a wrench time.....

Low Tide   5:24am
(Sun 23 August)
0.57 feet
(0.17 m)
High Tide   9:44am
(Sun 23 August)
2.27 feet
(0.69 m)
Low Tide   5:09pm
(Sun 23 August)
-0.02 feet
(-0.01 m)
High Tide   10:18pm
(Sun 23 August)
3.17 feet
(0.97 m)
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Offline EU

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5212 on: August 23, 2020, 02:39:00 PM »
Yeah I just don't understand this because lakes don't have tides like this...3 feet. The Columbia River river is above sea level.

Also, in the time I've spent on the river, I have only seen the river fluctuate a handful of inches. Certainly not 3 feet or 7 feet. That's nuts.

Maybe I'm missing something here?
« Last Edit: August 23, 2020, 02:39:43 PM by EU »
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Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5213 on: August 23, 2020, 02:40:06 PM »
Feb 11    2:57 A.M. PST     6.19 feet     High
Feb 11    9:52 A.M. PST     3.58 feet     Low
Feb 11    2:11 P.M. PST     8.43 feet     High
Feb 11   11:33 P.M. PST     1.09 feet     Low
Feb 12    4:05 A.M. PST     6.56 feet     High
Feb 12   11:05 A.M. PST     3.62 feet     Low
Feb 12    3:13 P.M. PST     8.71 feet     High
Feb 13   12:30 A.M. PST     0.45 feet     Low
Feb 13    5:02 A.M. PST     7.05 feet     High
Feb 13   12:10 P.M. PST     3.41 feet     Low
Feb 13    4:12 P.M. PST     9.08 feet     High
Feb 14    1:21 A.M. PST    -0.14 feet     Low
Feb 14    5:51 A.M. PST     7.56 feet     High
Feb 14    1:09 P.M. PST     3.02 feet     Low
Feb 14    5:08 P.M. PST     9.45 feet     High
Feb 15    2:07 A.M. PST    -0.61 feet     Low
Feb 15    6:36 A.M. PST     8.05 feet     High
Feb 15    2:03 P.M. PST     2.53 feet     Low
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Offline Robert99

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5214 on: August 23, 2020, 02:49:01 PM »
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8.43 is what they state...8.7 on the 12th...

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I agree with EU that something is wrong here.  Other information states that the daily tidal variations is only between 1 and 2 feet in the Tina Bar/Vancouver area.

The Corps of Engineers used to have data online showing the daily variation of the Columbia River water level at the Vancouver gage.  I no longer have that data but Georger may have it.  In any event, I specifically remember checking the water level variations at various times including February 1980 and those variations were in line with the 1 or 2 foot variations.

If there was an 8 foot tidal variation, the water level would practically be up to the road at some points on Tina Bar.  And that did not happen.

   
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Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5215 on: August 23, 2020, 02:56:04 PM »
How is that data so far off?
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Offline EU

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5216 on: August 23, 2020, 02:58:25 PM »
If the river rose 7 feet in any given day then the FBI trenches and everything they dug in 1980 would have been wiped out by the river in a matter of hours. Yet they were there for three days with trenches and everything undisturbed.
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Offline georger

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5217 on: August 23, 2020, 03:22:52 PM »
More Flyjaxck bullroar!

 FLYJACK

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     #62424

29 minutes ago (edited)

     
    5 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

    BREAKING... The dredge layer was identified by the Corps of Engineers... 

     

    armcordredgelayer.jpeg.639ebab3a8cefab48c5ee1717e1975e7.jpeg

Georger is attacking me again with his typical strawman nonsense,,, and misinformation because he didn't check the source. No wonder some of these guys have got nowhere in a decade. NEVER EVER trust anything Georger claims without checking thoroughly.

The FACTS..

QUOTE:

"The agents were joined Wednesday by Leonard Palmer, Portland State University geology professor, and Corps of Engineers specialists in analyzing the area. The Corps of Engineers identified a layer of sand as having been deposited when the 40-foot ship channel was dredged in August 1974."
Edited 17 minutes ago by FLYJACK

REPLY:  Bull.  What is the NAME of this USCE guy?  How come he isn't mentioned in the Palmer report or any any other FBI doc we received about the excavation?

If some uninvited USGE guy came and replaced Palmer where and what was Palmer doing? Playing his banjo?  Who at the FBI invited this un-named USCE person? WHAT WAS HIS FUCKING NAME? WHERE DID H3 COMEW FROM? HIS AFFILIATIONS? WHAT USCE OFFICE? WHAT HIS FUCKING PHONE NUMBER?

Give us a break Flyjack, from your adolescent bullshit.  And the next time you post an article to Dropzone make it big enough for an insect to read!

Any breakthrough on cold fusion or your time machine ... since last Monday?  :rofl:

**  The ONLY person present who was looking for and reading strata was Dr Leonard Palmer. There was no USCE guy present so far as any document I have ever seen. Tom what do you say?  The adolescent FJ probably thinks this is funny - which may be his intended purpose. Anything to put FJ in a leadership role!   :-\
« Last Edit: August 23, 2020, 03:30:39 PM by georger »
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Offline Robert99

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5218 on: August 23, 2020, 03:30:17 PM »
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How is that data so far off?

I have not seen the charts you presented before.

But about 10 years ago, I think it was the National Weather Service in Vancouver/Portland that referred me to a Corps of Engineers site that had data for the Vancouver gage from about 1972 to the present day.  Unfortunately, it didn't have data going back to the November 1971 date of the hijacking.

Georger may still have that data but I don't.  However, I can categorically state that there was never an 8 foot daily tidal in the 1980 time frame or any other time frame covered by that data.

The nominal Columbia River water level at Tina Bar is about 6 inches lower than the river water level at the Vancouver gage, which is about 10 miles upstream from Tina Bar.  The water level at Tina Bar is nominally about 5 feet or less above sea level.  Then it is about another 90 river miles to the Pacific Ocean which can be assumed to be sea level.  [If you really want to know the definition of "sea level" then Google the term.]

And remember that the present day Vancouver gage readings must be corrected to determine the gage readings in the 1970s.  This is due to a change in the vertical datum as has been discussed over the last few days. 
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Offline Shutter

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Re: Tina Bar Money Find
« Reply #5219 on: August 23, 2020, 03:44:12 PM »
Fly, you realize the actual "Palmer report" is not public knowledge? I believe Tom and Georger have it but we don't...am I correct georger?
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