Author Topic: Suspects And Confessions  (Read 1510825 times)

Offline Parrotheadvol

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #2400 on: March 13, 2018, 10:10:42 PM »
Okay I found it. It was something Jo said. I knew I had read it somewhere on DZ. Who knows if there is any truth to it, but regardless, I think we can all agree that Coffelt isn't DBC.

Found on DZ Cooper discussion, page 801:
Jo States:
Over the yrs Florence claimed per the writers - when she saw Coffelt's Photo. "Oh, my God " and claimed she didn't think she would ever see face again - I would have to look it up to get her exact wording.
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #2401 on: March 13, 2018, 11:12:28 PM »
Marla and Uncle LD

There is one element in the LD story that has yet to be told - who the original investigators were, what they found, and how they worked. One of them, Arden Dorney, was identified at the 2011 Portland Symposium, and if you weren't there and chatting with Marla after the show, you wouldn't have heard it directly from her.

Of course, I talked about Arden a lot at the DZ, the MN, and in my book, but that exposure only goes so far. Perhaps a brief recap might be in order due to the passage of the years.

Arden was a detective in the Elk City PD, in Oklahoma. This city is about 50 miles west of OK City. He did all the heavy lifting, and not only does he speak authoritatively about his findings, he is adamant that LD in DB Cooper. His belief is unshakable, as is his confidence in his police work.

Unfortunately, Arden may have been the sharpest tool in the Elk City PD, but he was astonishingly unfamiliar from hard questioning by an investigative journalist who knew Norjak well. After two rounds of interviews, Arden clammed up. He wouldn't even come to the phone when his wife was calling out to him.

In the course of his investigation of LD, he enlisted the help of a fellow LE buddy, an unnamed undercover FBI agent out of the Central Division, based in Chicago. Apparently the two buddies had worked drug cases together in Oklahoma.

Arden refused to tell me the FBI agent's name. Surprisingly, he never told Marla, either. Worse, she apparently never asked. At this point, I don't know anyone who does know the name of the undercover agent. GG might, because his relationship with Marla and Uncle LD is very strong, although I doubt that it is sexual or even remotely romantic.

But Arden did tell me that the FBI guy's involvement is what got Eng's attention. Arden's words were, "The FBI trusts only their own." Before the intervention of the UC fed, Dorwin told me threatening Eng with media exposure was unsuccessful, saying, "I told him I was going to go to CNN with the dossier if he didn't act on it, and I'd tell them that he (Eng) was sabotaging the case."

Once the UC got involved, Eng and Seattle got busy. The general feeling was that if the FBI UC agent said it was a solid case against LD, then it was gold. It took awhile for Seattle and FBI HQ to realize that there wasn't too much to their findings.

I asked the History Channel's FBI guy, former Assistant Director Tom Fuentes, about this incident, and if he followed up that is unknown to me. Even though he was the former director of the Central Division, too, he had never heard of the Central Div-UC-LD connection before.

So, lots was going on within the FBI in terms of their politics and decision-making.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2018, 11:22:25 PM by Bruce A. Smith »
 

georger

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #2402 on: March 13, 2018, 11:19:04 PM »
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... Dorwin Schreuder was not even involved in the case after 1980 so he is not a source for the information you seek! You have 'milked' Dorwin Schreuder for all you can imagine him saying about the 'whole' DB Cooper case!  ;) It's just another example of your biased sample size and methodology. (That still doesnt prevent people from writing books!)  :D


I don't believe that statement is fully accurate. As I understand Dorwin's involvement in Norjak, he was first the PIO for the money retrieval at T-Bar in 1980. Then he took over the Norjak file at Portland when Himms left two weeks later.

Dorwin told me he handled the Norjak case for some time. His grandson's book tabs Dorwin as retiring from the FBI in the early 1980s due in part to the toxic atmosphere within the Portland Division. The younger Schreuder writes that many of the FBI agents in Portland resented Dorwin's position as the Norjak guy, getting all the press time, fame, etc.

Nevertheless, Dorwin was quite specific when he told me that he had a passive approach to Norjak, waiting for the public to bring in leads, and indicated that was SOP at the Bureau.

That was Portland! Dorwin was at Portland.

The case was run at Seattle. Seattle had jurisdiction! Ever read any of the FOIA files released that come from Dorwin at Portland? What did Dorwin do, according to your interviews with Dorwin?

Bruce, tell us everything Dorwin accomplished as PIO at Portland, following Himm's retirement. What agents did Dorwin direct - what did they do? If as you say he was waiting on leads what leads did he get? Dorwin must have dome something - what was it!? 
« Last Edit: March 14, 2018, 12:26:01 AM by georger »
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #2403 on: March 13, 2018, 11:24:30 PM »
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... Dorwin Schreuder was not even involved in the case after 1980 so he is not a source for the information you seek! You have 'milked' Dorwin Schreuder for all you can imagine him saying about the 'whole' DB Cooper case!  ;) It's just another example of your biased sample size and methodology. (That still doesnt prevent people from writing books!)  :D


I don't believe that statement is fully accurate. As I understand Dorwin's involvement in Norjak, he was first the PIO for the money retrieval at T-Bar in 1980. Then he took over the Norjak file at Portland when Himms left two weeks later.

Dorwin told me he handled the Norjak case for some time. His grandson's book tabs Dorwin as retiring from the FBI in the early 1980s due in part to the toxic atmosphere within the Portland Division. The younger Schreuder writes that many of the FBI agents in Portland resented Dorwin's position as the Norjak guy, getting all the press time, fame, etc.

Nevertheless, Dorwin was quite specific when he told me that he had a passive approach to Norjak, waiting for the public to bring in leads, and indicated that was SOP at the Bureau.

That was Portland!

The case was run at Seattle. Ever read any of the FOIA files released. They all focus on ......... Katmandu and Beijing!  :rofl:

Oh, Georger, please. Of course I know that Norjak was run out of Seattle. I never said otherwise. What is important is that Portland also maintained a file on the case and acted upon the tips that came.

So, Georger, let's turn the tables: why do you think the FBI elevated LD Cooper to their "most promising" status?
« Last Edit: March 13, 2018, 11:25:50 PM by Bruce A. Smith »
 

georger

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #2404 on: March 13, 2018, 11:30:30 PM »
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... Dorwin Schreuder was not even involved in the case after 1980 so he is not a source for the information you seek! You have 'milked' Dorwin Schreuder for all you can imagine him saying about the 'whole' DB Cooper case!  ;) It's just another example of your biased sample size and methodology. (That still doesnt prevent people from writing books!)  :D


I don't believe that statement is fully accurate. As I understand Dorwin's involvement in Norjak, he was first the PIO for the money retrieval at T-Bar in 1980. Then he took over the Norjak file at Portland when Himms left two weeks later.

Dorwin told me he handled the Norjak case for some time. His grandson's book tabs Dorwin as retiring from the FBI in the early 1980s due in part to the toxic atmosphere within the Portland Division. The younger Schreuder writes that many of the FBI agents in Portland resented Dorwin's position as the Norjak guy, getting all the press time, fame, etc.

Nevertheless, Dorwin was quite specific when he told me that he had a passive approach to Norjak, waiting for the public to bring in leads, and indicated that was SOP at the Bureau.

That was Portland!

The case was run at Seattle. Ever read any of the FOIA files released. They all focus on ......... Katmandu and Beijing!  :rofl:

Oh, Georger, please. Of course I know that Norjak was run out of Seattle. I never said otherwise. What is important is that Portland also maintained a file on the case and acted upon the tips that came.

So, Georger, let's turn the tables: why do you think the FBI elevated LD Cooper to their "most promising" status?

One word. Politics. And it depends on whose "most promising status" you buy into - ON SOCIAL MEDIA ... DOMINICTUS BENEFACTUM PUELA SUNT?
« Last Edit: March 13, 2018, 11:31:41 PM by georger »
 

Offline MEYDC

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #2405 on: March 14, 2018, 08:12:45 AM »
Does any one have pics of Jack Coffelt. I haven't found any when his name was mentioned.
 

georger

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #2406 on: March 14, 2018, 04:35:08 PM »
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Does any one have pics of Jack Coffelt. I haven't found any when his name was mentioned.

No pic to date ?

 Posted on December 12, 2015 by Marty Andrade

Jack Coffelt

A conman who spent most of his life in prison, Coffelt claimed he was Cooper in 1972. Apparently the goal was to make money out of a movie deal, Coffelt himself died in 1975. The FBI interviewed him, but his story was wrong on several important details (which they have never released). Regardless, the details of Coffelt’s story we do know about are completely wrong. He claimed to land near Mt. Hood, which was too far south and too far west. He also claimed to have an accomplice and that, even though he landed very far from the Victor 23 corridor, they somehow met up and made their escape. Story is still being sold to the public by one of Coffelt’s former cellmates.
 

Offline 377

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #2407 on: March 14, 2018, 04:56:17 PM »
Why is there zero interest in Jack Collins, Bradley's dad?

Less qualified suspects get a lot more attention.

377
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #2408 on: March 14, 2018, 05:08:21 PM »
see photo
 
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Offline 377

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #2409 on: March 14, 2018, 05:38:31 PM »
From Wikipedia:

"Coffelt was a conman, ex-convict, and purported government informant who claimed to have been the chauffeur and confidante of Abraham Lincoln's last undisputed descendant, great-grandson Robert Todd Lincoln Beckwith. In 1972 he began claiming he was D.B. Cooper, and attempted through an intermediary, a former cellmate named James Brown, to sell his story to a Hollywood production company. He said he landed near Mount Hood, about 50 miles (80 km) southeast of Ariel, injuring himself and losing the ransom money in the process. Photos of Coffelt bear a resemblance to the composite drawings, although he was in his mid-fifties in 1971. He was reportedly in Portland on the day of the hijacking, and sustained leg injuries around that time which were consistent with a skydiving mishap.[124]

Coffelt's account was reviewed by the FBI, which concluded that it differed in significant details from information that had not been made public, and was therefore a fabrication.[125] Brown, undeterred, continued peddling the story long after Coffelt died in 1975. Multiple media venues, including the television news program 60 Minutes, considered and rejected it.[126] In a 2008 book about Lincoln's descendants,[127] author Charles Lachman revisited Coffelt's tale although it had been discredited 36 years before."

Sure wonder what undisclosed info the FBI uses to check Cooper confessor stories.

377

« Last Edit: March 14, 2018, 05:39:12 PM by 377 »
 

georger

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #2410 on: March 14, 2018, 06:05:35 PM »
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see photo

Those are not the proportions 'advertised' in any DB Cooper FBI sketch.  :-\
 

georger

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #2411 on: March 14, 2018, 06:08:53 PM »
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From Wikipedia:

"Coffelt was a conman, ex-convict, and purported government informant who claimed to have been the chauffeur and confidante of Abraham Lincoln's last undisputed descendant, great-grandson Robert Todd Lincoln Beckwith. In 1972 he began claiming he was D.B. Cooper, and attempted through an intermediary, a former cellmate named James Brown, to sell his story to a Hollywood production company. He said he landed near Mount Hood, about 50 miles (80 km) southeast of Ariel, injuring himself and losing the ransom money in the process. Photos of Coffelt bear a resemblance to the composite drawings, although he was in his mid-fifties in 1971. He was reportedly in Portland on the day of the hijacking, and sustained leg injuries around that time which were consistent with a skydiving mishap.[124]

Coffelt's account was reviewed by the FBI, which concluded that it differed in significant details from information that had not been made public, and was therefore a fabrication.[125] Brown, undeterred, continued peddling the story long after Coffelt died in 1975. Multiple media venues, including the television news program 60 Minutes, considered and rejected it.[126] In a 2008 book about Lincoln's descendants,[127] author Charles Lachman revisited Coffelt's tale although it had been discredited 36 years before."

Sure wonder what undisclosed info the FBI uses to check Cooper confessor stories.

377

Sure wonder how anyone can say 'Photos of Coffelt bear a resemblance to the composite drawings, although he was in his mid-fifties in 1971'.  More Jesus in the Toast I guess. Or the FBI sketches are meaningless to suspect peddlers? Lots of clone pots n pans and shoes available on the market, all at 1/3rd price.   :nono:

Are these peddlers just blind, or stupid, or both ... with no apparent skills in arithmetic either? Or, "it just does not matter. I WANT MY WAY!"  :rofl:
« Last Edit: March 14, 2018, 06:12:47 PM by georger »
 

Offline MEYDC

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #2412 on: March 14, 2018, 06:13:08 PM »
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From Wikipedia:

"Coffelt was a conman, ex-convict, and purported government informant who claimed to have been the chauffeur and confidante of Abraham Lincoln's last undisputed descendant, great-grandson Robert Todd Lincoln Beckwith. In 1972 he began claiming he was D.B. Cooper, and attempted through an intermediary, a former cellmate named James Brown, to sell his story to a Hollywood production company. He said he landed near Mount Hood, about 50 miles (80 km) southeast of Ariel, injuring himself and losing the ransom money in the process. Photos of Coffelt bear a resemblance to the composite drawings, although he was in his mid-fifties in 1971. He was reportedly in Portland on the day of the hijacking, and sustained leg injuries around that time which were consistent with a skydiving mishap.[124]

Coffelt's account was reviewed by the FBI, which concluded that it differed in significant details from information that had not been made public, and was therefore a fabrication.[125] Brown, undeterred, continued peddling the story long after Coffelt died in 1975. Multiple media venues, including the television news program 60 Minutes, considered and rejected it.[126] In a 2008 book about Lincoln's descendants,[127] author Charles Lachman revisited Coffelt's tale although it had been discredited 36 years before."

Sure wonder what undisclosed info the FBI uses to check Cooper confessor stories.

377

Sure wonder how anyone can say 'Photos of Coffelt bear a resemblance to the composite drawings, although he was in his mid-fifties in 1971'.  More Jesus in the Toast I guess. Or the FBI sketches are meaningless to suspect peddlers? Lots of clone pots n pans and shoes available on the market, all at 1/3rd price.   :nono:
The ears, nose, and hair I could see but not much else.
 

Offline MEYDC

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #2413 on: March 14, 2018, 06:28:50 PM »
Are surhttps://soundingsjohnbarker.files.wordpress.com/2017/11/cooper.png
e Shutter that pic is Jack Coffelt?
 

Offline MEYDC

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #2414 on: March 14, 2018, 06:30:19 PM »
The Last post didn't come out like I wanted. Shutter are you sure that pic is of Jack Coffelt?
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