Author Topic: Suspects And Confessions  (Read 1512737 times)

MeyerLouie

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #1875 on: May 30, 2017, 03:14:39 AM »
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Fly.... thats totally overthinking things...  Mucklow was trying to assuage a very tense situation,  with that comment....there's nothing there....

I know Tina's claim was that she was being humorous, asking for some money. It may be all true and innocent, but it just seems bizarre to me. To ask for the money, take it then return it and claim no gratuities allowed recalling company policy, it wasn't just a gratuity it was ransom money. This seems odd. It was the only time she was being humorous. She also claimed the money (which she held in her hands) was in bank-style bands contrary to other evidence. Her demeanour was a little sheepish in news footage as well.

Sometimes people make up stories to cover for their actions just in case, her prints are on some of the money. There is no evidence she did anything wrong but that particular story is as fishy as fishy gets.. IMO, it sounds like it may be deceptive in some way as though she was covering for the possibility that her prints might be later found on some cash.

Never automatically trust what "witnesses" say, look at actions. She (claimed she) took the package of money from the hijacker, why didn't she refuse it and quote her company policy. Did she take the earlier tip from the hijacker and then return it or just refuse it per company policy.

Remember she was 22 years old... From the east coast yet living on the west coast.... I would say her behavior was beyond superb and mature at the conference, not sheepish.   heck, a 22 year old stewardess today would have been dazed, checking her phone every two minutes, saying the word "like" five times a sentence, answering other questions than asked etc....

Now, if one wants to imply a possible covert CIA black OP of the entire caper,well, Ithats another discussion. and your talk about the money could fit that theory.... for this was during great national unrest with vietnam,with the public protesting,rioting,  etc, and there were alot of Black ops the CIA was doing yet couldn't get the funding from the public taxpayer via Congress...this is precisely why the CIA had to delve in the overseas drug trade,to fund some of these very necessary earmarked missions. And this operates outside the US banking system to which these dollars are called Eurodollars, and would never show up in the  search unless repatriated. Maybe caper did involve that Rackstraw like Colbert says (but on the ground) and that the money was planted etc....   many aspects of the caper could point to this, of the no solve,the no talk by any relative by now, NO TRACE, etc... I do think in this realm the money issue has a real place, but not involving Mucklow. They wouldn't use someone so young.

I don't believe Tina's age was the big deal here.  She was a professional, she was trained to do her job, and she was trained to deal with possible emergency situations -- thousands of feet up in the air, in an airplane.  At any age, no matter how you slice it -- that requires specialized training.   With all the hijackings going on back then, I'm sure stewards and stewardesses had special training in dealing with hijackings, in particular.   Twenty-two -- most of us were graduating from college about then and starting our first professional jobs.  It would seem that some semblance of maturity would be expected by that age.  They didn't have fidget spinners and Valley Girls back then, either.
Meyer
« Last Edit: May 30, 2017, 03:20:41 AM by MeyerLouie »
 

Offline dice

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #1876 on: May 30, 2017, 09:51:28 AM »
Quote

I don't believe Tina's age was the big deal here.   I'm sure stewards and stewardesses had special training in dealing with hijackings, in particular.   

Well I thought that the industry at the time had poor hijack training, but besides that, assuming she had it,  a 22 year old maintaining her composure while having to fear for her life, training or not, is a big deal. She kept her wits about her, like a champ....like a champ...
« Last Edit: May 30, 2017, 09:56:07 AM by Shutter »
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Offline Shutter

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #1877 on: May 30, 2017, 10:02:37 AM »
I fixed your quote box. only the end gets a forward slash that's why it didn't work. you can also copy what you want to place in the quote box, it's right beside the hashtag. the quote box is ready for anything you want to quote. click on it and then place what you have copied.
 

Offline EVickiW

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #1878 on: May 30, 2017, 10:17:19 AM »
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Fly.... thats totally overthinking things...  Mucklow was trying to assuage a very tense situation,  with that comment....there's nothing there....

I know Tina's claim was that she was being humorous, asking for some money. It may be all true and innocent, but it just seems bizarre to me. To ask for the money, take it then return it and claim no gratuities allowed recalling company policy, it wasn't just a gratuity it was ransom money. This seems odd. It was the only time she was being humorous. She also claimed the money (which she held in her hands) was in bank-style bands contrary to other evidence. Her demeanour was a little sheepish in news footage as well.

Sometimes people make up stories to cover for their actions just in case, her prints are on some of the money. There is no evidence she did anything wrong but that particular story is as fishy as fishy gets.. IMO, it sounds like it may be deceptive in some way as though she was covering for the possibility that her prints might be later found on some cash.

Never automatically trust what "witnesses" say, look at actions. She (claimed she) took the package of money from the hijacker, why didn't she refuse it and quote her company policy. Did she take the earlier tip from the hijacker and then return it or just refuse it per company policy.

Remember she was 22 years old... From the east coast yet living on the west coast.... I would say her behavior was beyond superb and mature at the conference, not sheepish.   heck, a 22 year old stewardess today would have been dazed, checking her phone every two minutes, saying the word "like" five times a sentence, answering other questions than asked etc....

Now, if one wants to imply a possible covert CIA black OP of the entire caper,well, Ithats another discussion. and your talk about the money could fit that theory.... for this was during great national unrest with vietnam,with the public protesting,rioting,  etc, and there were alot of Black ops the CIA was doing yet couldn't get the funding from the public taxpayer via Congress...this is precisely why the CIA had to delve in the overseas drug trade,to fund some of these very necessary earmarked missions. And this operates outside the US banking system to which these dollars are called Eurodollars, and would never show up in the  search unless repatriated. Maybe caper did involve that Rackstraw like Colbert says (but on the ground) and that the money was planted etc....   many aspects of the caper could point to this, of the no solve,the no talk by any relative by now, NO TRACE, etc... I do think in this realm the money issue has a real place, but not involving Mucklow. They wouldn't use someone so young.

During the time of the hi-jacking,Tina Mucklow had an apartment in one of the smaller suburbs of Minneapolis, Minnesota. In fact, the entire crew was based out of the Minneapolis Hub for Northwest Orient. Tina did not move to the West Coast until after the hi-jacking.
You are entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts.
 
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Offline Shutter

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #1879 on: May 30, 2017, 10:35:52 AM »
I believe this is the location where Tina lived at that time...I don't have the full address anymore, but the photo is her building..
 
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Offline dice

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #1880 on: May 30, 2017, 11:20:49 AM »
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Tina did not move to the West Coast until after the hi-jacking

Fair enough, but the point was, she was a 22 year old, who lived quite far from home...
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Offline EVickiW

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #1881 on: May 30, 2017, 01:32:43 PM »
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Tina did not move to the West Coast until after the hi-jacking

Fair enough, but the point was, she was a 22 year old, who lived quite far from home...

Just trying to keep the known facts in the forefront. Somehow little remarks made in error end up being a "fact".
You are entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts.
 
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Offline Shutter

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #1882 on: May 30, 2017, 03:23:00 PM »
I think Tina tried to defuse a difficult situation. cops do the samething by asking you if you have any rocket launchers or grenades when they ask you whats in the vehicle. could she be lying, sure, but her actions don't show it. even after the hijacking. it hit them differently, Florence was looking under her car for a bomb thinking he was coming to get her..

I think the crew did what they had to do, and was professional all the way to the end. I just wish they would of went in the back earlier vs waiting till they landed...
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #1883 on: May 30, 2017, 05:50:48 PM »
Tina

Let's not lose sight of the fact that Bill Rataczak said publicly that Tina was "the brains of the outfit," and he bought her a bottle of Chanel#5 on behalf of the whole cockpit crew for saving their bacon. His note to Tina on the perfume said: "The guys in the front of the plane are here today because of what you did," or words to that effect.

To me, Tina had a level of comfort and savvy with DBC that Florence did not. Plus, Tina stayed with Cooper for up to five hours, 45 minutes of which she was alone with him, and she didn't loose her cool. In addition, Tina looks very comfortable and articulate in front of the cameras after the hijacking.

Yet, to me these behaviors are in striking contrast to the woman she became. For me, the question is why.
 

Offline Kermit

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #1884 on: May 30, 2017, 06:35:38 PM »
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Tina

Let's not lose sight of the fact that Bill Rataczak said publicly that Tina was "the brains of the outfit," and he bought her a bottle of Chanel#5 on behalf of the whole cockpit crew for saving their bacon. His note to Tina on the perfume said: "The guys in the front of the plane are here today because of what you did," or words to that effect.

To me, Tina had a level of comfort and savvy with DBC that Florence did not. Plus, Tina stayed with Cooper for up to five hours, 45 minutes of which she was alone with him, and she didn't loose her cool. In addition, Tina looks very comfortable and articulate in front of the cameras after the hijacking.

Yet, to me these behaviors are in striking contrast to the woman she became. For me, the question is why.

You don't think that people at times treating her like she was part of the caper could be part of her change in personality ? I know I would quickly tire of being nice and open when there are those that suspect me ! To me she was awesome to have handled all this while not even sure if her life might soon end !
 

MeyerLouie

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #1885 on: May 30, 2017, 07:35:49 PM »
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Tina

Let's not lose sight of the fact that Bill Rataczak said publicly that Tina was "the brains of the outfit," and he bought her a bottle of Chanel#5 on behalf of the whole cockpit crew for saving their bacon. His note to Tina on the perfume said: "The guys in the front of the plane are here today because of what you did," or words to that effect.

To me, Tina had a level of comfort and savvy with DBC that Florence did not. Plus, Tina stayed with Cooper for up to five hours, 45 minutes of which she was alone with him, and she didn't loose her cool. In addition, Tina looks very comfortable and articulate in front of the cameras after the hijacking.

Yet, to me these behaviors are in striking contrast to the woman she became. For me, the question is why.

You don't think that people at times treating her like she was part of the caper could be part of her change in personality ? I know I would quickly tire of being nice and open when there are those that suspect me ! To me she was awesome to have handled all this while not even sure if her life might soon end !


Not bad for a 22-year old -- she was mature beyond her years.  PTSD can be delayed in its manifestation.  The horrible reality of PTSD may take quite a while to surface.  And I believe that's exactly what happened to Tina.  The change in her over the years after the hijacking was pretty dramatic.  IMHO, she fell prey to this horrible thing called PTSD.  I have no doubt in my mind about this.  I have some experience with the condition myself.

Meyer
 
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Robert99

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #1886 on: May 30, 2017, 07:58:37 PM »
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Tina

Let's not lose sight of the fact that Bill Rataczak said publicly that Tina was "the brains of the outfit," and he bought her a bottle of Chanel#5 on behalf of the whole cockpit crew for saving their bacon. His note to Tina on the perfume said: "The guys in the front of the plane are here today because of what you did," or words to that effect.

To me, Tina had a level of comfort and savvy with DBC that Florence did not. Plus, Tina stayed with Cooper for up to five hours, 45 minutes of which she was alone with him, and she didn't loose her cool. In addition, Tina looks very comfortable and articulate in front of the cameras after the hijacking.

Yet, to me these behaviors are in striking contrast to the woman she became. For me, the question is why.

Bruce,

For some reason (presumably!) that seems known only to you, your repeated claims that Tina became a "basket case" does not have any support whatsoever.

From all available evidence, including her appearance on one of the recent TV shows, "the woman she [Tina] became" (and probably always was) was a lucid, completely sane, totally composed, young lady that puts you to shame. >:(

Why don't you spend some time trying to resolve your own personal problems?
« Last Edit: May 30, 2017, 08:01:32 PM by Robert99 »
 
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Offline dice

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #1887 on: May 30, 2017, 11:11:47 PM »
Quote
I believe that's exactly what happened to Tina.  The change in her over the years after the hijacking was pretty dramatic.  IMHO, she fell prey to this horrible thing called PTSD.


This is a related digression, but I don't believe for one second  that she went into the Carmelite cloth.... what I believe is that she and the FBI were genuinely concerned for her safety and welfare, as the only person who could finger Cooper...and including the desire to get away from the media hounds who wouldn't leave her alone....  so I believe the convent thing was a ruse, slightly similar in that Whoopi Goldberg film Sister Act, when they put her in there as a form of witness protection...even in Les Miserables....    doing this would get the media off her back and she could disappear into a new life with a new name, which she did...People cannot go in the convent so it could not be verified, and all needed to do this is participation by the head nun...and this isn't the first time authorities have used a convent as a ruse.

Doing this throws off both the public, the media, and possible Cooper eliminating his only true witness.  But regarding the stress, she never could get real privacy again, and have to worry about being killed to boot....some people can handle that..but most cannot.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2017, 11:22:41 PM by diclemeg »
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Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #1888 on: May 31, 2017, 03:12:07 AM »
So, Tina...

1. PTSD

2. Enters Witness Protection Program at Maria Regina, or a faux cover story.

3. Tina is a lucid, sane, composed lady who puts me to shame, etc...

4. Behaviors are a reaction to people suspecting that she is a criminal and part of the skyjacking.

The Forum's response certainly runs the gamut, eh?
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Suspects And Confessions
« Reply #1889 on: May 31, 2017, 03:16:42 AM »
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... doing this would get the media off her back and she could disappear into a new life with a new name, which she did...


Not quite, Dice. Tina kept her name, at least her married name and was in the phone book for 30+ years. 1991- 2012 or so. She left Springfield about then and is no longer public.