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[RaoulDuke24]

So the FBI still maintains possession of and control over the tie DNA? When the FBI closed the case and released the files, the DNA record was not released along with everything else? That's what I was curious about. Because if a citizen sleuth was able to get their hands on that DNA sample, that could really open up some doors thanks to the recent boom in popularity of DNA testing and websites like GEDMatch.

When Tom Kaye was in possession of the tie examining the particles, did he have it tested for DNA?

I believe the tie and parachute are now on display at the Smithsonian(??) Or at least they were(?) Not exactly sure of their whereabouts now. What are the chances a museum would allow for a DNA test of one of its artifacts? My guess is slim to none but who knows.

I believe the FBI has the tie.. and the Washington State Museum has the "unused" back parachute believed to be on the plane. Did Cooper touch that parachute??

Tom Kaye told me that there were around 14 partial DNA profiles found..

14 -- yikes. And all of them partials. So did Tom Kaye do DNA testing then? Or was his 14 number just what he was told by someone else? If Tom did in fact have DNA testing done himself, does he still have those records by chance??

I wonder how the FBI determined which one to use in their Lynn Doyle DNA test? Maybe they tested them all?

Is the unused parachute you refer to the one that was opened and cut for shroud lines? Cooper certainly touched those lines to cut them. But of course, how much of a DNA sample was left by him simply touching the lines (and not bleeding on them or getting saliva on them or anything else)? And how many other people (FBI agents, other law enforcement, etc.) touched those same parachute lines as well?

It's definitely a long shot. But a shot nonetheless.

If those cigarette butts ever turned up, I think it would be game over for Cooper given how far DNA technology has come.

[FLYJACK]

So the FBI still maintains possession of and control over the tie DNA? When the FBI closed the case and released the files, the DNA record was not released along with everything else? That's what I was curious about. Because if a citizen sleuth was able to get their hands on that DNA sample, that could really open up some doors thanks to the recent boom in popularity of DNA testing and websites like GEDMatch.

When Tom Kaye was in possession of the tie examining the particles, did he have it tested for DNA?

I believe the tie and parachute are now on display at the Smithsonian(??) Or at least they were(?) Not exactly sure of their whereabouts now. What are the chances a museum would allow for a DNA test of one of its artifacts? My guess is slim to none but who knows.

I believe the FBI has the tie.. and the Washington State Museum has the "unused" back parachute believed to be on the plane. Did Cooper touch that parachute??

Tom Kaye told me that there were around 14 partial DNA profiles found..

14 -- yikes. And all of them partials. So did Tom Kaye do DNA testing then? Or was his 14 number just what he was told by someone else? If Tom did in fact have DNA testing done himself, does he still have those records by chance??

I wonder how the FBI determined which one to use in their Lynn Doyle DNA test? Maybe they tested them all?

Is the unused parachute you refer to the one that was opened and cut for shroud lines? Cooper certainly touched those lines to cut them. But of course, how much of a DNA sample was left by him simply touching the lines (and not bleeding on them or getting saliva on them or anything else)? And how many other people (FBI agents, other law enforcement, etc.) touched those same parachute lines as well?

It's definitely a long shot. But a shot nonetheless.

If those cigarette butts ever turned up, I think it would be game over for Cooper given how far DNA technology has come.

14 partials enough to eliminate but not include...

The 2nd back parachute was intact and uncut.. there is some inconsistency and conflicting FBI info over the chutes..

But that Hayden chute was sold to the Washington State Museum and had been repacked 2X after the hijacking but unused.

Long shot, but if Cooper touched it modern DNA tech might be able to get something.

The other item, another long shot is the plane ticket.. FBI has that.

Modern touch DNA tech only needs 5-20 skin cells..

.

[georger]

So the FBI still maintains possession of and control over the tie DNA? When the FBI closed the case and released the files, the DNA record was not released along with everything else? That's what I was curious about. Because if a citizen sleuth was able to get their hands on that DNA sample, that could really open up some doors thanks to the recent boom in popularity of DNA testing and websites like GEDMatch.

When Tom Kaye was in possession of the tie examining the particles, did he have it tested for DNA?

I believe the tie and parachute are now on display at the Smithsonian(??) Or at least they were(?) Not exactly sure of their whereabouts now. What are the chances a museum would allow for a DNA test of one of its artifacts? My guess is slim to none but who knows.

When Tom Kaye was in possession of the tie examining the particles, did he have it tested for DNA?

no

[RaoulDuke24]

So it sounds like the only people with access to the DNA records is the FBI. Seems a bit counterproductive for them to just sit on the DNA results and not do anything with them when there are many, many citizen sleuths that would absolutely put it to good use.

It's been reported that the Golden State Killer wasn't even on the FBI's radar until just a couple weeks before the arrest was made. Just goes to show how quickly DNA can break a case. The GSK case involved victims to a far greater degree than the Cooper case, so the FBI had far more motivation to keep pursuing that one. But maybe (shall I say hopefully) this will spark them to use the same methodology to check out the Cooper DNA in the same database and see what comes up. If the case was still open, they just might. The fact that it's closed makes it far less likely.

[georger]

So it sounds like the only people with access to the DNA records is the FBI. Seems a bit counterproductive for them to just sit on the DNA results and not do anything with them when there are many, many citizen sleuths that would absolutely put it to good use.

It's been reported that the Golden State Killer wasn't even on the FBI's radar until just a couple weeks before the arrest was made. Just goes to show how quickly DNA can break a case. The GSK case involved victims to a far greater degree than the Cooper case, so the FBI had far more motivation to keep pursuing that one. But maybe (shall I say hopefully) this will spark them to use the same methodology to check out the Cooper DNA in the same database and see what comes up. If the case was still open, they just might. The fact that it's closed makes it far less likely.

Evidence has to be sequestered in an active case - cant share it with every curious party. Lots of concerns including legal concerns. 

[377]

So it sounds like the only people with access to the DNA records is the FBI. Seems a bit counterproductive for them to just sit on the DNA results and not do anything with them when there are many, many citizen sleuths that would absolutely put it to good use.

It's been reported that the Golden State Killer wasn't even on the FBI's radar until just a couple weeks before the arrest was made. Just goes to show how quickly DNA can break a case. The GSK case involved victims to a far greater degree than the Cooper case, so the FBI had far more motivation to keep pursuing that one. But maybe (shall I say hopefully) this will spark them to use the same methodology to check out the Cooper DNA in the same database and see what comes up. If the case was still open, they just might. The fact that it's closed makes it far less likely.

Evidence has to be sequestered in an active case - cant share it with every curious party. Lots of concerns including legal concerns.

Yup. Otherwise solid cases have been dismissed due to screwups in maintaining the physical integrity of evidence and a perfectly documented unbroken chain of custody. I was surprised Gray was allowed to handle evidence.

Loss of the cig butts could ruin the chances of a successful prosecution. A motion to dismiss based on "spoliation of evidence" would likely succeed.

377

[georger]

So it sounds like the only people with access to the DNA records is the FBI. Seems a bit counterproductive for them to just sit on the DNA results and not do anything with them when there are many, many citizen sleuths that would absolutely put it to good use.

It's been reported that the Golden State Killer wasn't even on the FBI's radar until just a couple weeks before the arrest was made. Just goes to show how quickly DNA can break a case. The GSK case involved victims to a far greater degree than the Cooper case, so the FBI had far more motivation to keep pursuing that one. But maybe (shall I say hopefully) this will spark them to use the same methodology to check out the Cooper DNA in the same database and see what comes up. If the case was still open, they just might. The fact that it's closed makes it far less likely.

Evidence has to be sequestered in an active case - cant share it with every curious party. Lots of concerns including legal concerns.

Yup. Otherwise solid cases have been dismissed due to screwups in maintaining the physical integrity of evidence and a perfectly documented unbroken chain of custody. I was surprised Gray was allowed to handle evidence.

Loss of the cig butts could ruin the chances of a successful prosecution. A motion to dismiss based on "spoliation of evidence" would likely succeed.

377

Agree 100000%. Their stunt with Gray alone could ruin the case.

I hope Gray is proud of his "greed"!

[RaoulDuke24]

So it sounds like the only people with access to the DNA records is the FBI. Seems a bit counterproductive for them to just sit on the DNA results and not do anything with them when there are many, many citizen sleuths that would absolutely put it to good use.

It's been reported that the Golden State Killer wasn't even on the FBI's radar until just a couple weeks before the arrest was made. Just goes to show how quickly DNA can break a case. The GSK case involved victims to a far greater degree than the Cooper case, so the FBI had far more motivation to keep pursuing that one. But maybe (shall I say hopefully) this will spark them to use the same methodology to check out the Cooper DNA in the same database and see what comes up. If the case was still open, they just might. The fact that it's closed makes it far less likely.

Evidence has to be sequestered in an active case - cant share it with every curious party. Lots of concerns including legal concerns.

Yup. Otherwise solid cases have been dismissed due to screwups in maintaining the physical integrity of evidence and a perfectly documented unbroken chain of custody. I was surprised Gray was allowed to handle evidence.

Loss of the cig butts could ruin the chances of a successful prosecution. A motion to dismiss based on "spoliation of evidence" would likely succeed.

377

The thing about the DNA results though is that there wouldn't be any physical evidence to handle. It's literally just some letter and number sequencing. All the FBI has to do is release that. They don't have to turn over a tie or anything.

[377]

Agree 100%. Releasing the code does nothing to alter or compromise the tissue evidence or expose it to theft. A genetic sequence is not like a bitcoin. 

377

[RaoulDuke24]

Is there a particular reason that the genetic sequence was not documented in the case files? I'm curious as to how they have a zillion pages of files but the DNA code is not included. It is, afterall, part of the case.

[georger]

Is there a particular reason that the genetic sequence was not documented in the case files? I'm curious as to how they have a zillion pages of files but the DNA code is not included. It is, afterall, part of the case.

302s so far do not cover the 2000-01 period. That was when dna entered the case.

Im not going to say anything further on this subject. Its a total waste of time.   

[RaoulDuke24]

Is there a particular reason that the genetic sequence was not documented in the case files? I'm curious as to how they have a zillion pages of files but the DNA code is not included. It is, afterall, part of the case.

Any discussion and/or lab reports are material. Not covered in a FOIA.

That was the only part I needed. You can spare me the rest.

[georger]

Is there a particular reason that the genetic sequence was not documented in the case files? I'm curious as to how they have a zillion pages of files but the DNA code is not included. It is, afterall, part of the case.

Any discussion and/or lab reports are material. Not covered in a FOIA.

That was the only part I needed. You can spare me the rest.

and I will - we dont want you harmed with too many facts! Each to his own according to his means and needs. 

[RaoulDuke24]

Is there a particular reason that the genetic sequence was not documented in the case files? I'm curious as to how they have a zillion pages of files but the DNA code is not included. It is, afterall, part of the case.

Any discussion and/or lab reports are material. Not covered in a FOIA.

That was the only part I needed. You can spare me the rest.

and I will - we dont want you harmed with too many facts! Each to his own according to his means and needs. 

I want all the facts I can get. That's exactly what I'm looking for anytime I ask a question. I just prefer my facts to be served without a side of snarkiness.

[fcastle866]

Assuming he survived the jump, how old would he be now if he was still alive?  If he was 18 in 1945 at the end of WW2, born in 1927, he'd be in his 90's.  Would they prosecute? What does the DNA get us if he's dead?  I read tonight that they are trying to get DNA from envelopes sent by the Zodiac killer and get this DNA tested privately like they did with GSK, and then feed it into the system.  Zodiac is a crime the police still want to solve, is D.B Cooper one they still want to catch?