Author Topic: General Questions About The Case  (Read 839041 times)

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #2895 on: January 24, 2021, 01:39:07 AM »
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Was it this photo?

No.

But that is a cool photo.
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #2896 on: January 24, 2021, 10:37:23 PM »
That's the only one that pops up..it's a photoshop pic.
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #2897 on: January 25, 2021, 04:26:14 AM »
As I recall it, the 727 on the aircraft carrier was a sketched poster, not a pix.
 

Offline Lynn

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #2898 on: January 25, 2021, 06:58:10 PM »
Someone has probably already posted this but just in case. Guy dressed up like DB does the jump. 
 

Offline Dfs346

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General Questions About The Case
« Reply #2899 on: January 25, 2021, 07:28:00 PM »
A 2016 post by Bruce Smith states:
Ralph Himmelsbach, p. 13 NORJAK: "Lysne wrote 'Cooper, Dan' on the flight manifest, and wrote 'Seattle' and '52' on the ticket jacket in the spaces for destination and boarding gate.”

FBI Vault Part 10 page 443, footnote DB Cooper-1676, states: [redacted] Northwest Orient Airlines, advised that at approximately two p.m. November twenty four seventy one: white male came up to him in regular rotation in long line of customers and said something to the effect, "Can I get on your flight to Seattle?"

In the FBI document, which was written on a typewriter with uniform spacing of characters, the redacted text has a length equivalent to 34 characters including spaces. This would fit with "DENNIS EUGENE LYSNE, TICKET AGENT," or "DENNIS E. LYSNE, TICKETING AGENT", but also with "HAROLD X. WILLIAMS, TICKET AGENT," (where X is unknown).

Four questions if I may:
* Has anyone seen an unredacted copy of the FBI document?
* Is Himmelsbach's book the only document in the public domain that names Lysne as the ticket agent?
* Is there any other document that identifies the ticket agent?
* Has anyone on this forum ever communicated with Mr Lysne or Mr Williams?
« Last Edit: January 25, 2021, 07:31:57 PM by Dfs346 »
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #2900 on: January 26, 2021, 02:46:20 AM »
I think Geoffrey names Lysne and Williams in his book, Skyjack. I have not tried to communicate with either.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2021, 02:46:48 AM by Bruce A. Smith »
 

Offline Dfs346

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #2901 on: January 26, 2021, 07:39:53 AM »
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In the FBI document, which was written on a typewriter with uniform spacing of characters, the redacted text has a length equivalent to 34 characters

On re-reading Part 10 pages 443 and 444, I see that there are two further redactions which are both exactly 5 characters long. The redacted text must read LYSNE.
 
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Offline Dfs346

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #2902 on: January 27, 2021, 03:13:14 PM »
Having spent several decades in the market research industry, I recently devoted a few hours to thinking about how I would interview a person who had seen the hijacker and had retained a visual memory of him.

In such a situation, I think I would want to focus on the physical appearance, voice and body language of the hijacker, and not to ask about events, actions or chronology. I think I would not:
* make reference to any published artists' impressions of the hijacker (neither those of the FBI, nor those of private researchers)
* make reference to any proposed suspect, living or deceased
* give any indication that I hoped for or expected a particular response.

To that end, I developed a short questionnaire which consists entirely of generic visual images which allow the respondent to choose one, or more, or none, or reply "don't know" or "don't remember".

I would like to test this questionnaire on the members of this forum, of whom I suppose that many may have a mental image of the hijacker. With that preamble: admins/mods, may I have permission to post the questionnaire?
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #2903 on: January 27, 2021, 03:41:02 PM »
Quote
I would like to test this questionnaire on the members of this forum, of whom I suppose that many may have a mental image of the hijacker. With that preamble: admins/mods, may I have permission to post the questionnaire?

You don't have to ask for permission trying something like you want to try. go ahead a post what ever you want to ask other members..
 
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Offline Dfs346

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #2904 on: January 27, 2021, 05:20:07 PM »
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go ahead a post what ever you want to ask other members..

OK thanks, here's Part 1 of the questionnaire. (There is a Part 2, but I would like to test Part 1 first.)

Notes: (1) the page size is A4 (British); in case anyone wants to print it, I can resize it to US letter size.
(2) Question Q1b is of course only applicable to someone who was on the flight.
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #2905 on: January 27, 2021, 09:48:50 PM »
How do I select the different options in your survey?
 

Offline Dfs346

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #2906 on: January 28, 2021, 04:37:09 AM »
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How do I select the different options in your survey?
In fact, the purpose of my post was not to survey the members of this forum, but rather to seek views on whether the questionnaire would be workable in a live situation, i.e. with a surviving member of the crew or passengers.

In market research it's critical to have the questionnaire right in order to get good answers. For example, I wanted to seek views on, for example:
* whether multiple-choice is the right format as opposed to, say, open-ended questions (e.g. "what did the hijacker look like?") or yes/no choices (e.g. "was the hijacker Hispanic?") or factual answers (e.g. "how tall was the hijacker?")
* if multiple-choice is right, whether the respondent should be invited to select more than one response or only one
* whether there should be "tick boxes" on each page, or just a dotted line for the responses
* whether "don't remember" should be an explicit choice, or left to the respondent
* whether the number of images is about right, too many or too few
* whether the images should be color or grayscale
* whether the page format should be landscape or portrait
* whether the questionnaire could be completed in (say) under 5 minutes, so as not to fatigue the respondent
* whether the respondent would find it fun or a chore.

Having said that, I don't mind if a member wants to respond as if he/she were the interviewee. In that case the simplest way would be to post the answers, e.g. Q1(a) = B, Q2 = A, etc. If many members wanted to do this, we would probably have to set up a poll, which I suppose is possible with the forum software.
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #2907 on: January 28, 2021, 08:12:07 AM »
Quote
In fact, the purpose of my post was not to survey the members of this forum, but rather to seek views on whether the questionnaire would be workable in a live situation, i.e. with a surviving member of the crew or passengers.

Without knowing if anyone from the actual hijacking has ever seen the site makes it void. polls are already in place on this forum? the timing of your test is not good since not a lot of discussion is taking place. forums are basically made sort of like a questionnaire where they ask similar questions you presented. the test was kind of deceptive IMO?

If someone informed me that a passenger or crew member was going to be interviewed I could set up a thread for questions to be asked so the interviewer could then seek them out. McNally is a member on this forum. I was going to setup a time for him to be on the forum so people could ask him questions. this ended up failing because Martin doesn't know much about computers and navigating forums such as this one. something like that is about as close as you will get to a "live situation" polls work as well but typically take time to get results. sometimes they don't even know they are in place.
« Last Edit: January 28, 2021, 08:13:37 AM by Shutter »
 

Offline Dfs346

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #2908 on: January 28, 2021, 08:44:11 AM »
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Without knowing if anyone from the actual hijacking has ever seen the site makes it void.

It was not my assumption or expectation that any surviving crew member or passenger has ever visited this forum. My thinking was more as follows:

* In my understanding, some members of this forum (myself not among them) have relationships or at least contacts with surviving witnesses (crew members or passengers).
* Depending on the quality of those relationships, some witnesses might be willing to respond to a questionnaire such as this.
* The members of this forum could individually or collectively contribute to the quality of the questionnaire.
* If a good questionnaire could be developed, it would be up to the member having the relationship or contact, to approach the witness with appropriate safeguards for that person's privacy.
* If any useful insights emerged, and if the witness gave permission, those insights could be shared on this forum.
* In such a case, it would be in accordance with best industry practice if the witness were assured that he/she would not be identified by name.

This is simply my perspective from a market research career.
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #2909 on: January 28, 2021, 09:59:28 AM »
I agree. as I stated a thread could be made for the purpose of collecting questions that could be used in a interview. personally, I don't think the passengers will be of much help for several reasons. time and the fact of them not knowing who Cooper was. Mitchell has mentioned no longer being able to really identify anyone. I think only the actual picture of Cooper would trigger the memory with the stews since so much time has passed.

It's really hard to recall events from years back that really had no importance to them at the time. it's only after the fact they realized what happened. can you even identify or remember who was in line at the grocery store yesterday or what type of vehicles were at the gas station? even if you were asked an hour later? since it wasn't important the odds are you won't remember. now, if something happens at the store and you are taken hostage for two hours you will have a better recall like the stews had.