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Author Topic: General Questions About The Case  (Read 774951 times)

georger

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #1200 on: January 22, 2017, 12:02:21 AM »
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Hello everyone been following the DB Cooper case for some time.
Has anyone ever spoke about how he may of gotten to the Portland airport the day of the hijacking?
Did he take a taxi,bus did someone drop him off, drive his own car?

A search was supposedly done at Portland and in Vancouver. People of all types from all walks of life interviewed. Let's call it a 'canvas'. The same was done at Eugene albeit smaller, by all reports. .... and in other locations and venues. Tacoma, for instance. People searching included the FBI, Sheriff's departments, city police, companies, the military, ... and individuals trying to help. Private individuals called in tips from all over the country... the result was evidently nothing.

The FBI developed a 'favorites list' but those people were all cleared.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2017, 01:22:47 AM by georger »
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Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #1201 on: January 22, 2017, 03:28:20 AM »
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Hello everyone been following the DB Cooper case for some time.
Has anyone ever spoke about how he may of gotten to the Portland airport the day of the hijacking?
Did he take a taxi,bus did someone drop him off, drive his own car?

As I understand the Cooper literature, how DB Cooper got to Portland airport has never been conclusively determined. My sources for saying that include Larry Carr's commentary at the DZ, Geoffrey Gray's book, Skyjack, informal discussions with other Cooper researchers about their interactions with FBI agents, such as Galen Cook, and of course the whole Cooper library from authors: Calame and Rhodes, Himmelsbach, Tosaw, etc.
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Offline dice

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Why 'Dan LeClair', was Cooper
« Reply #1202 on: January 23, 2017, 10:22:45 AM »
Having recently read Gunther's book DB Cooper:What Really Happened, and perusing all these other suspects that do not fit, the new information about the tie, fits well with LeClair, as he is, by far, in my opinion, the most likely of the known suspects.
The book was ridiculed when it first came out, and was dismissed... but evidence that came out well after publication, does point, and fits, as LeClair being Cooper.  I am utterly amazed how everyone is looking the other way from this guy.
Everything, especially of the behavior of LeClair and especially Clara... the psycology and motivation are all very reasonable, and logical.
Gunther deliberately changed details as to protect the two sources, as he agreed....
Assuming it is LeClair.... to find him, one should contact Gunther's heirs to see if they have the original data provided by LeClair and Clara.....and then do a search based on that....  If its not available, then one should start with searching the Paratrooper records, and isolating all those Canadian born (gunther said London, Ontario which likely means its not there but in eastern Canada)... for this seems one of things that Gunther didn't shield...  and then isolate the ones who went to a public university in on the east coast on the GI Bill (Gunther said it was Rutgers, so I figure it'd be on the east coast, but definitely not Rutgers for having said it).   Then, of the few on the list, find the one who disappeared from his family....  those seem to me, the data points that Gunther didn't obfuscate.
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Offline Shutter

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #1203 on: February 05, 2017, 10:54:53 AM »
Page 51 of the documents seem to conflict with the timing on the transcripts...If I'm reading this correct they are implying that they are in the area of Toledo?
« Last Edit: February 05, 2017, 10:58:50 AM by Shutter »
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FLYJACK

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #1204 on: February 05, 2017, 11:36:25 AM »
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Hello everyone been following the DB Cooper case for some time.
Has anyone ever spoke about how he may of gotten to the Portland airport the day of the hijacking?
Did he take a taxi,bus did someone drop him off, drive his own car?

As I understand the Cooper literature, how DB Cooper got to Portland airport has never been conclusively determined. My sources for saying that include Larry Carr's commentary at the DZ, Geoffrey Gray's book, Skyjack, informal discussions with other Cooper researchers about their interactions with FBI agents, such as Galen Cook, and of course the whole Cooper library from authors: Calame and Rhodes, Himmelsbach, Tosaw, etc.

Something that I have always wondered about, maybe a simple explanation..

When he purchased the ticket, how was the Hijacker assured the plane was a 727 with aft stairs..

Was the plane model published in 1971? Did NWA always use the same plane model on routes?
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Robert99

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #1205 on: February 05, 2017, 12:38:38 PM »
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Hello everyone been following the DB Cooper case for some time.
Has anyone ever spoke about how he may of gotten to the Portland airport the day of the hijacking?
Did he take a taxi,bus did someone drop him off, drive his own car?

As I understand the Cooper literature, how DB Cooper got to Portland airport has never been conclusively determined. My sources for saying that include Larry Carr's commentary at the DZ, Geoffrey Gray's book, Skyjack, informal discussions with other Cooper researchers about their interactions with FBI agents, such as Galen Cook, and of course the whole Cooper library from authors: Calame and Rhodes, Himmelsbach, Tosaw, etc.

Something that I have always wondered about, maybe a simple explanation..

When he purchased the ticket, how was the Hijacker assured the plane was a 727 with aft stairs..

Was the plane model published in 1971? Did NWA always use the same plane model on routes?

In the 1971 time frame, the airlines jointly published a telephone book sized collection of all the cities that were served by airlines, the flights into and out of those cities including arrival and departure times, and the equipment that was used.  If different size aircraft were used on different days it was so noted in that schedule book and the book itself was updated about every couple of months or so.

Cooper probably used that very book to determine the place that would be the most convenient for him to board a 727 (all of which had aft stairs) and he specifically asked the clerk at the NWA counter at PIA if the inbound airliner (which was slightly late and hadn't arrived when he bought the ticket) was a 727.  The clerk told him that it was a 727, meaning no last minute switches in equipment, so Cooper was assured that he was getting the airliner he wanted.

During the wait to board the airliner, Cooper was in a waiting room with the other people who were boarding in Portland.  After getting on the airliner, Cooper had a chance to view the people in the cabin that were through passengers.  He obviously did not recognize anyone he knew.  So he had the 727 he wanted and a cabin full of strangers.  He then gave Flo the hijack note as the plane was taking off.  If Cooper had recognized anyone in the cabin, he would have cancelled his plans to hijack the aircraft and simply gotten off in Seattle and started planning for another attempt.
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georger

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #1206 on: February 05, 2017, 12:46:35 PM »
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Hello everyone been following the DB Cooper case for some time.
Has anyone ever spoke about how he may of gotten to the Portland airport the day of the hijacking?
Did he take a taxi,bus did someone drop him off, drive his own car?


As I understand the Cooper literature, how DB Cooper got to Portland airport has never been conclusively determined. My sources for saying that include Larry Carr's commentary at the DZ, Geoffrey Gray's book, Skyjack, informal discussions with other Cooper researchers about their interactions with FBI agents, such as Galen Cook, and of course the whole Cooper library from authors: Calame and Rhodes, Himmelsbach, Tosaw, etc.

Something that I have always wondered about, maybe a simple explanation..

When he purchased the ticket, how was the Hijacker assured the plane was a 727 with aft stairs..

Was the plane model published in 1971? Did NWA always use the same plane model on routes?

He asked if it was a 727 coming.

He could have seen a schedule like this at some airport, or asked about late afternoon schedules for the upcoming Thanksgiving holiday . You can see flt 305 is listed. But the late afternoon flt Cooper took was a recent addition. He may have simply called several airports to find out what flights were going to be available late afternoon the day before Thanksgiving. Remember, he told Tina it was the 'right plane, right place and time'. This may have been a spur of the moment decision on his part after thinking about it and looking for an opportunity, for some time.     

The FBI canvased the Portland area and could find nobody who id'd seeing Cooper before, in the city or at the airport. Canvases were also done in Eugene, Tacoma, and Seattle, and in other venues ...

Here is a NWO 727 seating arrangement advert.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2017, 02:16:04 PM by georger »
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FLYJACK

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #1207 on: February 05, 2017, 02:30:35 PM »
I did find a schedule.. credit Snowmann..

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georger

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #1208 on: February 05, 2017, 03:24:19 PM »
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I did find a schedule.. credit Snowmann..

But who knows if he ever saw these - or the Cooper comic, for that matter. It's all speculation.

Nobody was able to connect him to Portland, PDX, or the city of Portland ... and people tried to find any connection or ID. He could have located this time and place from afar then showed up and asked 'is this a 727 coming in?'

I assume he asked about it being a 727 'before' he bought the ticket, but Im not sure about that. The rest is history.

ps* I wonder what he would have done had he been unable to get any parachutes once on the plane?  :)) Or if they had told him it would take 10 hours or maybe nobody would supply them to him!
« Last Edit: February 05, 2017, 03:33:55 PM by georger »
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Robert99

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #1209 on: February 05, 2017, 03:34:48 PM »
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I did find a schedule.. credit Snowmann..

But who knows if he ever saw these - or the Cooper comic, for that matter. It's all speculation.

Nobody was able to connect him to Portland, PDX, or the city of Portland ... and people tried to find any connection or ID. He could have located this time and place from afar then showed up and asked 'is this a 727 coming in?'

I assume he asked about it being a 727 'before' he bought the ticket, but Im not sure about that. The rest is history.

The flight schedule books that I have described above could probably be found in any medium size library as well as Joint Airline Ticket Offices (JATO) on military bases and large federal agencies and commercial businesses.  I have used the JATOs at government military and civilian agencies to plan trips, both personal and business, as well as buy tickets for personal travel.  Tickets for business travel were secured through our office personnel but came from the JATOs also.

To repeat, Cooper could have easily determined the aircraft that was scheduled for the Portland to Seattle flight without asking anyone.  Asking the NWA clerk if it was a 727 means that Cooper already knew a 727 was scheduled.  He was just double checking.
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georger

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #1210 on: February 05, 2017, 03:39:19 PM »
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I did find a schedule.. credit Snowmann..

But who knows if he ever saw these - or the Cooper comic, for that matter. It's all speculation.

Nobody was able to connect him to Portland, PDX, or the city of Portland ... and people tried to find any connection or ID. He could have located this time and place from afar then showed up and asked 'is this a 727 coming in?'

I assume he asked about it being a 727 'before' he bought the ticket, but Im not sure about that. The rest is history.

The flight schedule books that I have described above could probably be found in any medium size library as well as Joint Airline Ticket Offices (JATO) on military bases and large federal agencies and commercial businesses.  I have used the JATOs at government military and civilian agencies to plan trips, both personal and business, as well as buy tickets for personal travel.  Tickets for business travel were secured through our office personnel but came from the JATOs also.

To repeat, Cooper could have easily determined the aircraft that was scheduled for the Portland to Seattle flight without asking anyone.  Asking the NWA clerk if it was a 727 means that Cooper already knew a 727 was scheduled.  He was just double checking.

If he had already known he wouldnt have had to ask.

Had he bought the ticket before he asked?  ;)  If he had already bought the ticket he either assumed it or thought he knew it. Maybe it didnt matter! He wasn;t bringing any parachutes with him. Maybe he had a plan B, and C and D ?
« Last Edit: February 05, 2017, 03:42:54 PM by georger »
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Robert99

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #1211 on: February 05, 2017, 04:14:16 PM »
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I did find a schedule.. credit Snowmann..

But who knows if he ever saw these - or the Cooper comic, for that matter. It's all speculation.

Nobody was able to connect him to Portland, PDX, or the city of Portland ... and people tried to find any connection or ID. He could have located this time and place from afar then showed up and asked 'is this a 727 coming in?'

I assume he asked about it being a 727 'before' he bought the ticket, but Im not sure about that. The rest is history.

The flight schedule books that I have described above could probably be found in any medium size library as well as Joint Airline Ticket Offices (JATO) on military bases and large federal agencies and commercial businesses.  I have used the JATOs at government military and civilian agencies to plan trips, both personal and business, as well as buy tickets for personal travel.  Tickets for business travel were secured through our office personnel but came from the JATOs also.

To repeat, Cooper could have easily determined the aircraft that was scheduled for the Portland to Seattle flight without asking anyone.  Asking the NWA clerk if it was a 727 means that Cooper already knew a 727 was scheduled.  He was just double checking.

If he had already known he wouldnt have had to ask.

Had he bought the ticket before he asked?  ;)  If he had already bought the ticket he either assumed it or thought he knew it. Maybe it didnt matter! He wasn;t bringing any parachutes with him. Maybe he had a plan B, and C and D ?

In asking the ticket agent, Cooper was only attempting to confirm that the scheduled 727 was the aircraft incoming and that there had not been any last minute changes in the scheduled equipment.
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FLYJACK

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #1212 on: February 05, 2017, 04:30:57 PM »
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I did find a schedule.. credit Snowmann..

But who knows if he ever saw these - or the Cooper comic, for that matter. It's all speculation.

Nobody was able to connect him to Portland, PDX, or the city of Portland ... and people tried to find any connection or ID. He could have located this time and place from afar then showed up and asked 'is this a 727 coming in?'

I assume he asked about it being a 727 'before' he bought the ticket, but Im not sure about that. The rest is history.

The flight schedule books that I have described above could probably be found in any medium size library as well as Joint Airline Ticket Offices (JATO) on military bases and large federal agencies and commercial businesses.  I have used the JATOs at government military and civilian agencies to plan trips, both personal and business, as well as buy tickets for personal travel.  Tickets for business travel were secured through our office personnel but came from the JATOs also.

To repeat, Cooper could have easily determined the aircraft that was scheduled for the Portland to Seattle flight without asking anyone.  Asking the NWA clerk if it was a 727 means that Cooper already knew a 727 was scheduled.  He was just double checking.

If he had already known he wouldnt have had to ask.

Had he bought the ticket before he asked?  ;)  If he had already bought the ticket he either assumed it or thought he knew it. Maybe it didnt matter! He wasn;t bringing any parachutes with him. Maybe he had a plan B, and C and D ?

In asking the ticket agent, Cooper was only attempting to confirm that the scheduled 727 was the aircraft incoming and that there had not been any last minute changes in the scheduled equipment.

and like you said, if it wasn't the right model plane he would have just exited in Seattle and nobody would ever have known about it.

I was researching the BAC 1-11 which also had rear stairs, to see if it had ever been jumped from or if it was a "known" possibility
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Robert99

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #1213 on: February 05, 2017, 11:23:21 PM »
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I did find a schedule.. credit Snowmann..

But who knows if he ever saw these - or the Cooper comic, for that matter. It's all speculation.

Nobody was able to connect him to Portland, PDX, or the city of Portland ... and people tried to find any connection or ID. He could have located this time and place from afar then showed up and asked 'is this a 727 coming in?'

I assume he asked about it being a 727 'before' he bought the ticket, but Im not sure about that. The rest is history.

The flight schedule books that I have described above could probably be found in any medium size library as well as Joint Airline Ticket Offices (JATO) on military bases and large federal agencies and commercial businesses.  I have used the JATOs at government military and civilian agencies to plan trips, both personal and business, as well as buy tickets for personal travel.  Tickets for business travel were secured through our office personnel but came from the JATOs also.

To repeat, Cooper could have easily determined the aircraft that was scheduled for the Portland to Seattle flight without asking anyone.  Asking the NWA clerk if it was a 727 means that Cooper already knew a 727 was scheduled.  He was just double checking.

If he had already known he wouldnt have had to ask.

Had he bought the ticket before he asked?  ;)  If he had already bought the ticket he either assumed it or thought he knew it. Maybe it didnt matter! He wasn;t bringing any parachutes with him. Maybe he had a plan B, and C and D ?

In asking the ticket agent, Cooper was only attempting to confirm that the scheduled 727 was the aircraft incoming and that there had not been any last minute changes in the scheduled equipment.

and like you said, if it wasn't the right model plane he would have just exited in Seattle and nobody would ever have known about it.

I was researching the BAC 1-11 which also had rear stairs, to see if it had ever been jumped from or if it was a "known" possibility

Several airliners in the 1960s and 1970s, including the DC-9/MD-80 series, had aft stairs.  But the 727 was apparently the only one that did not have some kind of locking mechanism to prevent the stairs from being lowered in flight.
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Offline RaoulDuke24

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Re: General Questions About The Case
« Reply #1214 on: June 04, 2017, 10:06:56 AM »
Does anyone know how many flights from Seattle to Portland were made that day in the hours prior to the hijacking? I'm sure that information is out there (possibly even posted/discussed here previously?)

Much has been made about where Cooper was from and how he got to the Portland airport. Being such a short flight, there's a big possibility he started his journey in Seattle that morning, boarded a flight to Portland and then went from there. He may have wanted to jump much sooner than he actually did (as evidenced by wanting to take off with the aft stairs down and communicating to the crew fairly early in the flight that he couldn't get the stairs down). That suggests he wanted out of the plane closer to Seattle.

Was there a large number of flights from Seattle to Portland that morning? Just a couple?

Part 2 of my question is ---- I've read about the FBI talking to bus drivers and cab drivers and other transportation workers in the Portland area, trying to determine if anyone remembered Cooper and figuring out how he got to the airport. They even canvassed the airport parking lot looking for abandoned cars.

Was this same thing done with transportation workers in Seattle and the Seattle airport parking lot?
« Last Edit: June 04, 2017, 10:17:57 AM by RaoulDuke24 »
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