Author Topic: Flight Path And Related Issues  (Read 1102909 times)

Offline Olemisscub

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #990 on: August 02, 2016, 12:36:46 PM »
"bring it on?"

I'm not threatening you dude. Calm down.

Bruce, I think you are mistaking the tone of my post, which is a major problem when you have to solely rely on the written word. I like you and I think you are a relentless investigator and so I generally appreciate your efforts with NORJAK and I enjoyed your book. My tone wasn't hostile at all in that post. I'm just saying that your tactics regarding Tina are disagreeable to me and they obviously were to her as well and that your aggressiveness could have gotten you in trouble if someone really had it out for you. Having worked as a criminal lawyer doing both prosecution and defense at various times, I've had to track down and deal with countless witnesses. Generally people only need to tell me "no" twice and I'll respect their wishes.

I realize that Tina's lack of communication about the case over the years is frustrating. It's probably the most frustrating aspect of this whole NORJAK case. How great would it be if she spoke regularly about it and was very easy to get in touch with? How could would it be if she was active on internet forums? It'd be pretty sweet. Unfortunately, that's not who she is.

Tina's idiosyncrasies throughout her life are likely more to do with her childhood or some other aspect of her life as opposed to a few hours that she spent with a hijacker. It's unfortunate that the star witness in the whole thing happens to be someone whose personality is a bit odd and very guarded, but it is what it is.

You lose me when you start to bring up MKULTRA and that type of stuff. It's so much more likely that Cooper was just a clever criminal who was influenced by the skyjacking attempt that occurred a few weeks earlier in Canada as opposed to him being some mind controlled Manchurian Candidate.
« Last Edit: August 02, 2016, 12:37:06 PM by Olemisscub »
 
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Robert99

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #991 on: August 02, 2016, 12:47:31 PM »
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A Tina Mucklow Lawsuit

OleMiss, just imagine - if you are correct, I might be the first person successfully arrested and convicted in conjunction with the Norjak case.

I wonder what that might do to book sales. Could I still collect my royalties in prison from a book deal I made before incarceration? Is the Son of Sam ruling retroactive?

Bruce, if my memory is correct, you would be the second person arrested and convicted in conjunction with the Cooper hijacking.  I believe the first person tried to defraud some people in the Cooper matter, or something like that, and had some serious legal problems as a result.

Why do you continue to claim that the airliner was far to the east of Portland and flying over the Cascade Mountains when all the aircraft that were trying to intercept it were vectored to the west and southwest of Portland?

And why do you continue to try to make something out of the way tickets were issued by the airlines in the early 1970s when everyone who has actual knowledge of how that was done has told you that the ticket is a non-issue?
 

georger

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #992 on: August 02, 2016, 03:23:02 PM »
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A Tina Mucklow Lawsuit

OleMiss, just imagine - if you are correct, I might be the first person successfully arrested and convicted in conjunction with the Norjak case.

I wonder what that might do to book sales. Could I still collect my royalties in prison from a book deal I made before incarceration? Is the Son of Sam ruling retroactive?

Bruce, if my memory is correct, you would be the second person arrested and convicted in conjunction with the Cooper hijacking.  I believe the first person tried to defraud some people in the Cooper matter, or something like that, and had some serious legal problems as a result.

Why do you continue to claim that the airliner was far to the east of Portland and flying over the Cascade Mountains when all the aircraft that were trying to intercept it were vectored to the west and southwest of Portland?

And why do you continue to try to make something out of the way tickets were issued by the airlines in the early 1970s when everyone who has actual knowledge of how that was done has told you that the ticket is a non-issue?

It's called "ideation"! Tina brought it up because she's tired and a little afraid of dealing with possessed wackos!  :)) :)) :))
« Last Edit: August 02, 2016, 03:23:50 PM by georger »
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #993 on: August 02, 2016, 04:37:31 PM »
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A Tina Mucklow Lawsuit

OleMiss, just imagine - if you are correct, I might be the first person successfully arrested and convicted in conjunction with the Norjak case.

I wonder what that might do to book sales. Could I still collect my royalties in prison from a book deal I made before incarceration? Is the Son of Sam ruling retroactive?

Bruce, if my memory is correct, you would be the second person arrested and convicted in conjunction with the Cooper hijacking.  I believe the first person tried to defraud some people in the Cooper matter, or something like that, and had some serious legal problems as a result.

Why do you continue to claim that the airliner was far to the east of Portland and flying over the Cascade Mountains when all the aircraft that were trying to intercept it were vectored to the west and southwest of Portland?

And why do you continue to try to make something out of the way tickets were issued by the airlines in the early 1970s when everyone who has actual knowledge of how that was done has told you that the ticket is a non-issue?

1. You are correct, R99, the fellows who defrauded What'shisname from Newsweek with bogus 20s in the early 1970s were first to the hoosegow.

2. I'm not claiming that 305 was east of V-23. I'm saying that Rataczak may be saying that. As for the location of the trailing aircraft, corroboration of their flight paths would be most welcome in my view.

3. I'm not "making anything" of the tickets. I'm trying to find out what happened during the ticket purchase. Did Cooper sign or not? I want to know, especially since Colbert and Company is making a major push to prove Rackstraw is DB Cooper via hand-writing analysis; namely, Rackstraw's signature is similar to the "Dan Cooper" written on the ticket.
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #994 on: August 02, 2016, 04:45:56 PM »
What more proof do you need about the ticket? the FBI stated the ticket was not written by Cooper, NWO has claimed they don't allow the passengers to write on the ticket.John Maximuk wrote a letter to WSHS stating the same?

Cooper was very careful in retrieving all his notes, so why would he write on a ticket with multiple copies?

 I believe this myth started with Grey Cop. he was one of the first to bring the myth up in the first place.

Unsolved Crimes website is starting to look good for you?

 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #995 on: August 02, 2016, 04:50:04 PM »
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"bring it on?"

I'm not threatening you dude. Calm down.

Bruce, I think you are mistaking the tone of my post, which is a major problem when you have to solely rely on the written word. I like you and I think you are a relentless investigator and so I generally appreciate your efforts with NORJAK and I enjoyed your book. My tone wasn't hostile at all in that post. I'm just saying that your tactics regarding Tina are disagreeable to me and they obviously were to her as well and that your aggressiveness could have gotten you in trouble if someone really had it out for you. Having worked as a criminal lawyer doing both prosecution and defense at various times, I've had to track down and deal with countless witnesses. Generally people only need to tell me "no" twice and I'll respect their wishes.

I realize that Tina's lack of communication about the case over the years is frustrating. It's probably the most frustrating aspect of this whole NORJAK case. How great would it be if she spoke regularly about it and was very easy to get in touch with? How could would it be if she was active on internet forums? It'd be pretty sweet. Unfortunately, that's not who she is.

Tina's idiosyncrasies throughout her life are likely more to do with her childhood or some other aspect of her life as opposed to a few hours that she spent with a hijacker. It's unfortunate that the star witness in the whole thing happens to be someone whose personality is a bit odd and very guarded, but it is what it is.

You lose me when you start to bring up MKULTRA and that type of stuff. It's so much more likely that Cooper was just a clever criminal who was influenced by the skyjacking attempt that occurred a few weeks earlier in Canada as opposed to him being some mind controlled Manchurian Candidate.

I'm calming down OMC. Thank you for your reassurance.

As for MKULTRA, my primary concern is not that DB Cooper was a Manchurian Candidate kind of guy, but that Tina may have been silenced via MKULTRA-like processes. Remember, MKULTRA had a varied arsenal of tools to control mind, mood, memory, and emotions: surgery, pharmaceuticals, behavioral conditioning, and other intrusive psychodynamics such electro-convulsive shock therapy, (ECT).

One of the ancillary topics of Norjak is MKULTRA; more specifically, what is the role of cloistered convents in our country these days? Are they just a place for ladies to pray? Or are they something else, such as a place to convalesce? I've thought about digging a little deeper into this area, but I simply gave up after a while because I needed to focus more on Cooper and publishing my book.

But I did talk with one nun who encouraged me to continue, saying that she knew of a convent in the Tacoma area that she thought was being used as a rehab facility for traumatized women who had been former CIA agents and had undergone psychological torture at the hands of their foreign captors.

Remember, torture, and in particular the techniques of MKULTRA, are not necessarily exclusive to the bailiwick of the United States. So, the question really is, how do we treat our espionage agents who come home totally zapped?
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #996 on: August 02, 2016, 04:53:27 PM »
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What more proof do you need about the ticket? the FBI stated the ticket was not written by Cooper, NWO has claimed they don't allow the passengers to write on the ticket.John Maximuk wrote a letter to WSHS stating the same?

Cooper was very careful in retrieving all his notes, so why would he write on a ticket with multiple copies?

 I believe this myth started with Grey Cop. he was one of the first to bring the myth up in the first place.

Unsolved Crimes website is starting to look good for you?

I have forwarded to Colbert all of the recent posts here concerning the tix. So, far, he says that he is unconvinced that he is wrong. Specifically, he says he has sworn testimony from two journalists who interviewed Larry Carr who told them that Cooper signed his tix.
 

Offline Parrotheadvol

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #997 on: August 03, 2016, 08:07:19 AM »
All due respect to Colbert, but it seems to me that he may be heading down the same road as some other folks that have their favorite suspect.
 

Offline MarkBennett

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #998 on: August 03, 2016, 10:06:30 AM »
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All due respect to Colbert, but it seems to me that he may be heading down the same road as some other folks that have their favorite suspect.
Yep.  It always reminds me of the quote from Larry Carr where he says people have their suspect and nothing can dissuade them from it. 

Tom Colbert's theory rests on some shaky assumptions, like the money being planted and that the person sending the "DB Cooper Letters" was Cooper himself.  Rackstraw had the skill set, but I don't see anything in Rackstraw's story that would lead someone to be that confident in him be Cooper - other than blind faith.
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #999 on: August 03, 2016, 10:36:30 PM »
Larry Carr....

"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you."He's not a viable suspect,"
« Last Edit: August 03, 2016, 11:45:51 PM by Shutter »
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #1000 on: August 15, 2016, 09:22:44 AM »
This comment has been placed here for reasons of it's content matching the topic.....


Haggarknew posted the following...

Yes I agree Robert99. He had knowledge of some things that the average passenger wouldn't have. So what do we make of this? Did this come from being a pilot? Was this knowledge due to his occupation? Would love to hear your thoughts (and everyone else) on this matter.
 

Robert99

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #1001 on: August 15, 2016, 01:13:50 PM »
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This comment has been placed here for reasons of it's content matching the topic.....


Haggarknew posted the following...

Yes I agree Robert99. He had knowledge of some things that the average passenger wouldn't have. So what do we make of this? Did this come from being a pilot? Was this knowledge due to his occupation? Would love to hear your thoughts (and everyone else) on this matter.

Cooper had more information on some aspects of the 727 than the NWA flight crew had.  He could have only obtained this information, either directly or indirectly, from the Boeing rear stair tests and/or the operational use of the modified 727s in Southeast Asia and maybe elsewhere.

Cooper specifically selected the 727 for his hijacking, and double checked with the NWA ticket agent in Portland that the incoming plane for his flight was a 727.

If Cooper's name ever becomes known, don't be surprised to find out that he was a former employee of the US Government, Boeing, or one of their subcontractors or front organizations.
 

Offline 377

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #1002 on: August 15, 2016, 01:44:54 PM »
The SAT 727 drop tests over Thailand had the stairs removed. You couldn't rapid fire a racked S/L cargo pallet drop with the stairs in the way.

But what about the Boeing 727 airdrop flight tests? Were the stairs lowered in flight? My guess is yes, but I have not seen the documents.

I'll bet Don Kirlin knows, but he has not revealed what he learned from Boeing during his successful fight to get FAA approval for skydives from a Boeing 727.

To me its beyond question that DBC knew quite a bit about planes and optimal configurations for airdrops.

IF, as one account reports,  he found and pulled an NB 8 packing card quickly then he knew a lot about parachutes. Himmelspach disputes that account. Most folks don't even know that parachute rigs have packing cards, and finding one on an NB8 is NOT EASY.

if Rackstraw was DBC, what was the point of impersonating a count and calling attention to yourself?

Rackstraw ought to consider admitting he is DBC (even if he isn't) and cash in on it. It would be a good con.  ;) Colbert has done all the work to support such a claim.

377
 

georger

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #1003 on: August 15, 2016, 02:12:11 PM »
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The SAT 727 drop tests over Thailand had the stairs removed. You couldn't rapid fire a racked S/L cargo pallet drop with the stairs in the way.

But what about the Boeing 727 airdrop flight tests? Were the stairs lowered in flight? My guess is yes, but I have not seen the documents.

I'll bet Don Kirlin knows, but he has not revealed what he learned from Boeing during his successful fight to get FAA approval for skydives from a Boeing 727.

To me its beyond question that DBC knew quite a bit about planes and optimal configurations for airdrops.

IF, as one account reports,  he found and pulled an NB 8 packing card quickly then he knew a lot about parachutes. Himmelspach disputes that account. Most folks don't even know that parachute rigs have packing cards, and finding one on an NB8 is NOT EASY.

if Rackstraw was DBC, what was the point of impersonating a count and calling attention to yourself?

Rackstraw ought to consider admitting he is DBC (even if he isn't) and cash in on it. It would be a good con.  ;) Colbert has done all the work to support such a claim.

377

Did he pull the cards on each chute - I presume each chute had one. Maybe he was looking for evidence of tampering or a tracking device ... and found the card(s). 
 

Offline 377

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #1004 on: August 15, 2016, 03:40:47 PM »
Georger wrote: Did he pull the cards on each chute - I presume each chute had one. Maybe he was looking for evidence of tampering or a tracking device ... and found the card(s).


Don't know. The account I read (as I recall it was in Tosaws book) just had him looking at the packing card in the rig he decided to wear.

Beacon transmitters are way too large to put in the tiny packing car pouch which is nearly flush with the container surface and tight fit for a small folded piece of paper. The beacons are normally installed between the pack tray and back pad.

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377

« Last Edit: August 15, 2016, 03:41:45 PM by 377 »