Author Topic: Flight Path And Related Issues  (Read 1102802 times)

Offline 377

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #735 on: August 18, 2015, 12:22:25 PM »
The pilots here know more than I do but I think planes that are modified for jumping have to get an STC, supplemental type certificate from the FAA. I have seen placards in jumpships that reference an FAA STC for "flight with door removed". Each type of plane needs its own STC.

Bruce ought to interview Don Kirlin. Kirlin might have seen interesting info when he got access to the Boeing 727 airdrop flight test archives. Don is an expert skydiver (I jumped with him at WFFC), 737 airline pilot, Navy fighter pilot etc. He is V E R Y savvy about all things aeronautical.

As an airline pilot, skydiver and the guy who forced the FAA to allow 727 sport jumps, he might bring a unique perspective to the DBC case.

377
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #736 on: August 18, 2015, 12:25:54 PM »
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Kirlin might have seen interesting info when he got access to the Boeing 727 airdrop flight test archives.

Yes, he seems to be a good candidate to speak with. I would also like to hear from McPheters again to find out exactly where he was on the beach, and how much he found.

 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #737 on: August 19, 2015, 03:21:50 PM »
How do I get in touch with Don Kirlin?  Any numbers?
 

Offline 377

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #738 on: August 19, 2015, 07:02:00 PM »
Don Kirlin's company:

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377

 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #739 on: August 19, 2015, 07:37:51 PM »
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377


That's one  :D
Hopefully we can get a hold of McPheters....
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #740 on: August 19, 2015, 09:19:12 PM »
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How do I get in touch with Don Kirlin?  Any numbers?


Does anyone have any questions they would like Bruce to include if he gets a hold of Don?
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #741 on: August 20, 2015, 01:14:08 AM »
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377


That's one  :D
Hopefully we can get a hold of McPheters....

I spoke with McPheters several years ago by phone. He lives in Moses Lake, WA.

I have his contact information is anyone feels they would like to clarify anything with him.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2015, 01:14:44 AM by Bruce A. Smith »
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #742 on: September 03, 2015, 09:23:16 PM »
SAGE RADAR

The following was posted on the "Death of Ted Mayfield" article at the Mountain News recently by a regular reader, DThurst, and I thought it is a succinct description of SAGE radar, how it works, and what contributions it might give us - or not - regarding the flight path and the presence of DB Cooper somewhere along it.

"SAGE would not have picked up a single person wearing a civilian parachute unless the parachute had a homing device incorporated in it or he was wearing suit of armor. As the system worked at the time, the SAGE computer at 25th NORAD Division at McChord taxes information from a number of different radar sites and presents it on a console at McChord. It is designed to track metal objects like airplanes and missiles which move laterally over terrain. A silk parachute and a human body would not move fast enough to be tracked. The "blip" on the radar would have been edited out of the computer display or dismissed as a bird or hot air balloon which NORAD does not track."

« Last Edit: September 03, 2015, 09:25:03 PM by Bruce A. Smith »
 

georger

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #743 on: September 03, 2015, 11:26:39 PM »
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377


That's one  :D
Hopefully we can get a hold of McPheters....

I spoke with McPheters several years ago by phone. He lives in Moses Lake, WA.

I have his contact information is anyone feels they would like to clarify anything with him.

Its time to do it - we aint going to live forever!  :D
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #744 on: September 03, 2015, 11:33:29 PM »
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Its time to do it - we aint going to live forever!

Questions needed

1) Where he was while searching the beach.
2) How many fragments were found, and the sizes.
3) Where did they go from Tina bar.
4) Who was in charge of evidence.
5)
6)
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #745 on: September 04, 2015, 01:34:33 AM »
Himms was in charge.

Dorwin was the PIO at T-Bar, and took over the Norjak/Portland,OR gig from Ralph when RH retired two weeks later. Dorwin told me that he didn't handle any of the frag transfers, if my memory serves me correctly.

I asked Himms where the money frags went after his team retrieved them from the sand. I sent him a letter. Never heard back directly from Himms, but Jerry Thomas called me a short time later saying that Ralph had told him to tell me that "everything was sent to Seattle." I wrote Ron Nichols if that was true, since RN was the Norjak case agent in 1980. Ronnie has never responded to me. I have strongly encouraged LMNO to contact Nichols - I gave them his winter address in Palm Desert and his summer address in Seattle. They seemed to understand the importance of talking to Nichols and getting answers to these kinds of questions, particularly since I told them that the Citizens Sleuths told me specifically that they didn't see any money shards at all in the evidence room in Seattle.

I will dig up Mike's phone number shortly and call him with these questions. It's time for a follow up.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2015, 01:35:57 AM by Bruce A. Smith »
 

georger

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #746 on: September 04, 2015, 01:50:32 AM »
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Himms was in charge.

Dorwin was the PIO at T-Bar, and took over the Norjak/Portland,OR gig from Ralph when RH retired two weeks later. Dorwin told me that he didn't handle any of the frag transfers, if my memory serves me correctly.

I asked Himms where the money frags went after his team retrieved them from the sand. I sent him a letter. Never heard back directly from Himms, but Jerry Thomas called me a short time later saying that Ralph had told him to tell me that "everything was sent to Seattle." I wrote Ron Nichols if that was true, since RN was the Norjak case agent in 1980. Ronnie has never responded to me. I have strongly encouraged LMNO to contact Nichols - I gave them his winter address in Palm Desert and his summer address in Seattle. They seemed to understand the importance of talking to Nichols and getting answers to these kinds of questions, particularly since I told them that the Citizens Sleuths told me specifically that they didn't see any money shards at all in the evidence room in Seattle.

I will dig up Mike's phone number shortly and call him with these questions. It's time for a follow up.

Seattle was in charge. All evidence collected went to Seattle.

Dorwin was only at the dig from about Noon of the first day into the evening and then part of the next day until around 3:00pm then had other things to do and was re-assigned - he was never at Tina Bar when Palmer was.

Dorwin refers to the plastic evidence envelopes they put frags' into as 'checque envelopes' - an envelope the size of a check. Multiple specimens found were placed in one envelope and according to Dorwin they ran out of envelopes and called in for more ...

 
« Last Edit: September 04, 2015, 03:35:29 AM by georger »
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #747 on: October 18, 2015, 04:42:31 PM »
I have a request for a simulation to be done. I was asked if a cockpit view from Ariel to the Columbia river can be made. I worked on it most of the day yesterday, and have the video loaded up on You Tube, but don't have any narration, or anything showing where the plane is at any given time. I didn't add any clouds due to not being able to see anything from the ground. the weather was put into the system.

I will be redoing the video so audio, and text will be seen and heard in order to make the video worth watching. I've discovered a major issue in the path's timing, but I'm currently running more testing to verify. a critical point was missing in my previous flights that I didn't think would cause an issue. I'll be using my female narrator so it will take a couple days to put together.

R99, I will have some questions for you regarding this area....

Shutter
 

Robert99

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #748 on: October 18, 2015, 05:49:37 PM »
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I have a request for a simulation to be done. I was asked if a cockpit view from Ariel to the Columbia river can be made. I worked on it most of the day yesterday, and have the video loaded up on You Tube, but don't have any narration, or anything showing where the plane is at any given time. I didn't add any clouds due to not being able to see anything from the ground. the weather was put into the system.

I will be redoing the video so audio, and text will be seen and heard in order to make the video worth watching. I've discovered a major issue in the path's timing, but I'm currently running more testing to verify. a critical point was missing in my previous flights that I didn't think would cause an issue. I'll be using my female narrator so it will take a couple days to put together.

R99, I will have some questions for you regarding this area....

Shutter

Okay, but don't expect any magic solutions on a flight path or timing that includes Ariel.  Those numbers just won't come out right regardless of what you do.
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #749 on: October 18, 2015, 06:11:21 PM »
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Okay, but don't expect any magic solutions on a flight path or timing that includes Ariel.  Those numbers just won't come out right regardless of what you do.

That's what I'm trying to set straight. contrary to what some say. I'm trying to verify the map. if it doesn't jive, we can go from the point forward.