I've ran two tests today from take off to a finish point of crossing the Lewis river. I'm getting a time of 34 minutes of flight time. that's what the clock reads. I'm starting the clock, and allowing a 30 second stall prior to take off, or a 7:36:30 second real time take off time.
Temp 42 degree's
wind 180 degrees at 21 knots
altitude 10,000
Fuel Flow 4500
Flaps 15 degrees
Gear down
TAT reads -9
speed 160-170 KIAS
Ground Speed 195-201
It appears to me after doing this dozens of times. the path can be flown in the manor it's shown on the map. I think it boils down to asking how accurate the path is from east to west in many locations.
we have people claiming the plane was west of the known flight path. this has some documentation attached with it. I believe others believe the path was east of the known flight path. how do we figure out where the hell the plane was on November 24, 1971 at 7:51 to about 8:22 that evening?
It sure as XXXX didn't come in over the Troutdale airport as JT says. There is ample firsthand documentation to discount that completely. I wish Rataczak would talk with us seriously. Oh well ...
Good work. Thanks.
PS: The placard defines the northern segment of the FP. I guess you can't use the money at TBar in the same way -
even if you draw a reasonable arc (well defined) around the whole area of TBar and assume the plane had to cross somewhere within that radius. That would be the ordinary approach. If you back up toward Vancouver say 4 miles now I'm willing to bet the FBI would have accepted that as falling within 'defined limits', whatever those limits are?
Yes there is the matter of flow. Maybe the money washed in from Idaho! I think that's somewhere east of the Washougal. Maybe it washed in from ..... France where they had the Dan Cooper comic! France is east of the Washougal! Point is, in this whole discussion lasting years literally nobody (save for R99) has been willing to try and define a reasonable radius from Tina Bar ... which the people in France would accept! Funny.
So, here's a brand new theory: the dredging deposits at Tina Bar aren't the whole story! There were deposits put east of Tina Bar, on Fazio property, which we have not been told about! Those deposits came from ... dredging more near Portland! Viola! It is those deposits that moved the money to Tina Bar after a period of time? Some scenario like that. That compromise keeps the FBI flight path and moves money to Tina Bar. I like compromises with the Devil!
Georger and Shutter, let's discuss some limitations involving the Tina Bar area. At Tina Bar, the Columbia River runs almost straight north, or about 2 degrees east of true north to be exact. So the Fazio property is EAST of Tina Bar and about one-fourth of a mile wide (measured east to west). On the east side of the Fazio property, at least the sand and dairy operations part of it, is the North West Lower River Road which is built on top of a levee. So basically nothing is going to move across the Fazio property from the east except during extreme flooding which would have to top the North West Lower River Road and cover most of the Fazio property.
I believe some dredged material was placed between the river's edge and the sand operation which is on the south side of the dairy operation. But personally, I doubt that any dredged material included Cooper or the money. Since more than one packet of bills were found together, it suggests to me that they didn't move very far after getting out of the money bag and also suggests repeatability in that the packets may have arrived at the same location at slightly different times (maybe a handful of days).
The Columbia River's normal level is about 5 to 7 feet Above Sea Level with a daily tidal variation of less than 2 feet. Based on photographs of the FBI agents digging after the money find, I would estimate that the money was found at about 10 to 12 feet ASL. And the money would have to arrive at Tina Bar at that level or above it.
Further, Tom Kaye's money experiments indicated that the first thing that happens to a packet of bills (with one rubber band at the center) is that the bills fan out and then the packet sinks and stays on the bottom. This means to me that once on the bottom, the bills would never return to the surface. So to repeat, the money would have to arrive at Tina Bar at the level it was found or from above that level.
Tom used his experiments to discount the Washougal Wash Down theory. I completely agree with that and would go further by stating that the airliner was never over the Washougal watershed in the first place. So in my opinion, if the money was ever in the Columbia River its entrance into the river would have to be roughly somewhere between Tina Bar and the point where the airliner crossed back over solid ground several miles south of Tina Bar.
Remember that if the airliner was bypassing Portland on the west side, as suggested by some of the maps and book narratives, it would basically fly over the Columbia River for several miles and would not be further west than the west side of the river as it passed Tina Bar. This simple consideration suggests that Cooper would have to be a no-pull and died in the jump. It also suggest that Cooper landed on solid ground on the EAST side of the river in the Tina Bar area. The reasoning for this is quite simple and involves parachute operational considerations. The flushing channel between the Columbia River and Vancouver Lake is basically the southernmost point that Cooper could have landed.
So broadly speaking, in my opinion Cooper landed somewhere between Tina Bar and the flushing channel (north and south) and between the Columbia River and the North West Lower River Road (east and west). A study of contour maps reduces greatly the possible landing sites for Cooper. When all is said and done, a landing area for Cooper can probably be stated that is less than one-half square mile in size, and perhaps as little as one-eight of a square mile. Hopefully, more accurate data than is presently available will be released in due time. If that happens, then meaningful progress can be made in resolving the Cooper case.
Robert99
