Author Topic: Flight Path And Related Issues  (Read 983550 times)

Offline georger

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3182
  • Thanked: 467 times
Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2100 on: May 03, 2019, 12:03:05 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
here is a couple photo's I don't think have been seen much, if any. one is the rear stairs during the test but a pic I haven't seen. the second link is the cockpit crew during the testing..and eattle January 6, 1972...too big to post.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Here, a bit lighter. Cant push it any further in jpeg format without distortions.  Any names of these people?
« Last Edit: May 03, 2019, 12:04:22 AM by georger »
 

Offline Robert99

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1711
  • Thanked: 196 times
Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2101 on: May 03, 2019, 12:23:20 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
here is a couple photo's I don't think have been seen much, if any. one is the rear stairs during the test but a pic I haven't seen. the second link is the cockpit crew during the testing..and eattle January 6, 1972...too big to post.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Here, a bit lighter. Cant push it any further in jpeg format without distortions.  Any names of these people?

The fellow in the foreground looking at the flight engineer's panel is probably Harald Anderson who was the flight engineer on the hijacked aircraft.  The gray haired fellow in the right side in the co-pilot's seat may be Soderland.  Rataczak was suppose to be the pilot on these tests so he would be in the left side in the pilot's seat but there is no way to identify him in that picture.

Are there any more pictures of the cockpit crew?
 

Offline georger

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3182
  • Thanked: 467 times
Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2102 on: May 03, 2019, 12:35:29 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
thin, like a decal. the picture I posted looks to be about the same size. I guess I should say similar to a decal but more stable since it's plastic.

Hominid, email sent to me in 2014...

The placard was on the outside of a panel door that was adjacent to the normal airstair
control handle.  It was "stuck" there with adhesive.  It was probably made of metal foil,
but might have been plastic.  Inside that door was the control that the placard related
to, the control for the "emergency" (pneumatic) airstair extension system.  The control
was a red handle that had to be pulled hard in order to break a lockwire.  NWA did not
want people pulling the handle by mistake thinking it to be the normal way of dropping the
stair.  This is why it was inside a "cabinet" and had the lockwire.  They didn't want it
to be used for a routine dropping of the airstair because using this system would damage
the stair such that it would have to be repaired before it could be closed and locked for
flight.

BTW the placard was transferred from Cowlitz County to the Seattle FBI office.   
 

Offline georger

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3182
  • Thanked: 467 times
Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2103 on: May 03, 2019, 12:38:44 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
here is a couple photo's I don't think have been seen much, if any. one is the rear stairs during the test but a pic I haven't seen. the second link is the cockpit crew during the testing..and eattle January 6, 1972...too big to post.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Here, a bit lighter. Cant push it any further in jpeg format without distortions.  Any names of these people?

The fellow in the foreground looking at the flight engineer's panel is probably Harald Anderson who was the flight engineer on the hijacked aircraft.  The gray haired fellow in the right side in the co-pilot's seat may be Soderland.  Rataczak was suppose to be the pilot on these tests so he would be in the left side in the pilot's seat but there is no way to identify him in that picture.

Are there any more pictures of the cockpit crew?

The left seat guy is older than Rataczak. Is this photo from the TAG team test flight?  Here is the tag team. Rataczak wasnt on that test flight.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2019, 12:45:33 AM by georger »
 
The following users thanked this post: fcastle866

Offline Robert99

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1711
  • Thanked: 196 times
Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2104 on: May 03, 2019, 02:06:11 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
here is a couple photo's I don't think have been seen much, if any. one is the rear stairs during the test but a pic I haven't seen. the second link is the cockpit crew during the testing..and eattle January 6, 1972...too big to post.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Here, a bit lighter. Cant push it any further in jpeg format without distortions.  Any names of these people?

The fellow in the foreground looking at the flight engineer's panel is probably Harald Anderson who was the flight engineer on the hijacked aircraft.  The gray haired fellow in the right side in the co-pilot's seat may be Soderland.  Rataczak was suppose to be the pilot on these tests so he would be in the left side in the pilot's seat but there is no way to identify him in that picture.

Are there any more pictures of the cockpit crew?

The left seat guy is older than Rataczak. Is this photo from the TAG team test flight?  Here is the tag team. Rataczak wasnt on that test flight.

Based on the color of the shirts, the fellow in the left seat is probably Al Lee, the NWA Chief Pilot in the Seattle area.  There is no way to tell who the fellow in the jump seat might be.  But he is possibly an FBI agent due to his white shirt.
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4365
  • Thanked: 465 times
    • The Mountain News
Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2105 on: May 03, 2019, 03:56:04 AM »
Al Lee was Chief Pilot AND Sea-Tac Ground Chief for NWO? Whoa.

BTW, Shut, I loved the pix of Seattle-Tacoma airport in 1971. What a sleepy little airport. Sure ain't that way, nowadays...
 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9300
  • Thanked: 1024 times
Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2106 on: May 03, 2019, 06:47:15 AM »
WSHS sent me 49 pictures. I was looking for the possibility of getting a picture of the stairs that could show the two sets of compartments to lower the stairs. two photo's show the normal release door open and possibly covering the emergency release cover panel where the placard would be. since the door was blocking the view it didn't show the placard missing or the door. not many 727's had this option. most had the free fall release.

The information Flyjack found shows many airlines failed to train employee's properly with the two systems. Tina showed Cooper how to lower them but he still had trouble or was confused since they only dropped a few feet. he either found the second panel or it didn't exist on the aircraft and he finally went down the stairs. the panel must come off to access the emergency release. if the placard went out the back with the panel attached. what happened to the panel. if Cooper used the option, why did it take two days to notice a hole in the wall? 305 had the stairs lined with panels vs canvas. I don't believe any testing was done two days later that conflicts with the newspaper article stating they noticed it missing during the testing in January. the stairs were not locked as far as I know. a pressure bump would not of occurred if they were locked.

Cowlitz county contacted me yesterday with zero results. she said they don't have many records of anything that far back.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
« Last Edit: May 03, 2019, 07:32:19 AM by Shutter »
 
The following users thanked this post: fcastle866

Offline fcastle866

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 282
  • Thanked: 108 times
Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2107 on: May 03, 2019, 08:18:04 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
WSHS sent me 49 pictures. I was looking for the possibility of getting a picture of the stairs that could show the two sets of compartments to lower the stairs. two photo's show the normal release door open and possibly covering the emergency release cover panel where the placard would be. since the door was blocking the view it didn't show the placard missing or the door. not many 727's had this option. most had the free fall release.

The information Flyjack found shows many airlines failed to train employee's properly with the two systems. Tina showed Cooper how to lower them but he still had trouble or was confused since they only dropped a few feet. he either found the second panel or it didn't exist on the aircraft and he finally went down the stairs. the panel must come off to access the emergency release. if the placard went out the back with the panel attached. what happened to the panel. if Cooper used the option, why did it take two days to notice a hole in the wall? 305 had the stairs lined with panels vs canvas. I don't believe any testing was done two days later that conflicts with the newspaper article stating they noticed it missing during the testing in January. the stairs were not locked as far as I know. a pressure bump would not of occurred if they were locked.

Cowlitz county contacted me yesterday with zero results. she said they don't have many records of anything that far back.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Great quality pics Shutter. Thanks for posting.  I'm amazed sometimes at the quality of pictures from that time.  For whatever reason the pictures my dad had put on slides are much better quality than pictures that were printed back then.  These two remind me of that type of quality.  Do you plan to put any of the other 49 pics up?  I wouldn't fault you if you decided  to save them for another time.
 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9300
  • Thanked: 1024 times
Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2108 on: May 03, 2019, 11:12:56 AM »
I will post a few more but the pics are like the 302's. Doubles are included in the 49.
 

Offline georger

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3182
  • Thanked: 467 times
Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2109 on: May 03, 2019, 01:56:15 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Al Lee was Chief Pilot AND Sea-Tac Ground Chief for NWO? Whoa.

BTW, Shut, I loved the pix of Seattle-Tacoma airport in 1971. What a sleepy little airport. Sure ain't that way, nowadays...

Interesting statement! What a sleepy little airport. Sure ain't that way, nowadays...  But some claim loudly PDX and Portland was a BUSTLING METROPOLIS WITH MILLIONS OF PEOPLE TO PROTECT - no pilot would be allowed to fly a bomb over METRO PORTLAND and METRO PDX! One more reason why the west path is true. Isnt this an example of what Sluggo meant by CULTURAL GOGGLES or CULTURAL FALSEHOODS that are built into people's theories?

But we wont talk about that! Hush-hush! The show must go on!  The media and the show, is the message! ;)
« Last Edit: May 03, 2019, 04:14:49 PM by georger »
 
The following users thanked this post: andrade1812

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9300
  • Thanked: 1024 times
Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2110 on: May 03, 2019, 07:33:06 PM »
A couple more photo's...

Cockpit view
Aircraft identification
Chase plane
Back stairs.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login


You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login



You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login



You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
« Last Edit: May 03, 2019, 07:34:45 PM by Shutter »
 
The following users thanked this post: georger

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9300
  • Thanked: 1024 times
Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2111 on: May 03, 2019, 08:57:58 PM »
If people are confused about the controls on the inside of the stairs. I made a diagram showing what it looks like. I hope the size fits along with the words in the photo. I'm working off a 100 inch diagonal screen.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2019, 10:40:02 PM by Shutter »
 
The following users thanked this post: Bruce A. Smith, georger

Offline georger

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3182
  • Thanked: 467 times
Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2112 on: May 03, 2019, 11:56:46 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
If people are confused about the controls on the inside of the stairs. I made a diagram showing what it looks like. I hope the size fits along with the words in the photo. I'm working off a 100 inch diagonal screen.

I am still unsure about exactly where this panel is? Here is a pic FJ posted.

Thanks for your pics! I will lighten a few that need it and post them back.

Are the stairs immediately to the left (around the corner) from the control panel placard? Is the control panel behind this placard, on a door to the control panel ????
« Last Edit: May 03, 2019, 11:58:45 PM by georger »
 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9300
  • Thanked: 1024 times
Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2113 on: May 04, 2019, 12:04:54 AM »
walking to the back of the plane. once you hit the stairs. the controls would be to your left. they are on the other side of the pressurized door.
 

Offline Shutter

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9300
  • Thanked: 1024 times
Re: Flight Path And Related Issues
« Reply #2114 on: May 04, 2019, 12:09:07 AM »
Here you can see the door open to lower the stairs....the open door is opposite the gauges..


You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login