The data is pretty much based on dropping the card and drifting. the card went out the back of a plane at high speeds. any data on that? any data on what the card will do when it hits the jet stream? this is basing it on a perfect drift from 10,000.

my card was 6 x 6 and weighs about an ounce. it showed different characteristics. this is a fact. if the card did spiral downward then it is going to line up basically with the area of it's exit.

If I give you all kinds of specs on how straight a 22 caliber bullet will fly and shoot the gun in high winds. what do you think will happen to all the data I gave to prove how straight a 22 will fly?

The data is pretty much based on dropping the card and drifting. the card went out the back of a plane at high speeds. any data on that? any data on what the card will do when it hits the jet stream? this is basing it on a perfect drift from 10,000.

my card was 6 x 6 and weighs about an ounce. it showed different characteristics. this is a fact. if the card did spiral downward then it is going to line up basically with the area of it's exit.

If I give you all kinds of specs on how straight a 22 caliber bullet will fly and shoot the gun in high winds. what do you think will happen to all the data I gave to prove how straight a 22 will fly?

As I said before, the AF did a study on paper, plastic, etc being dropped. Hom found the study and referred it to me. Im too busy to look for it. It wont matter to the Cooper zealots anyway. They will just make up their own account.   

Eric, try to keep up? the flight path is an estimate, just as it states right on the map. it has a margin of error built into it forward and backwards and side to side. can be one minute plus or minus and around one half mile side to side. I'm not telling you anything. I'm explaining that variables are at play with the placard. we don't know what the placard did. it suggests that it possibly spiraled downward since the only available evidence is the path.

The map was made by the USAF. the times were calculated onto the X's in order to try and located the possible, I'm possible jump time. the time and area was changed over time due to information coming in, possible error's as stated by a traffic controller. McChord was responsible for tracking anything that threatens our safety. to believe these guys threw something together doesn't fly with me.

The jump map seems to use the 8:11 location while many use the 8:12 location and as Bruce claims Rat said 8:13 as well as 5 - 10 minutes after Cooper's last communication. that gives a time frame to 8:15. ham operators were listening in and gave input to help locate the time. the FDR, helped with speed, altitude, and heading. the traffic controllers state they never left V23. I don't think any of the pilots say this either.

The money location is not a fact in anything other than belonging to part of the $200,000. if you can't prove without a doubt how that money got on Tbar you certainly can not use it as fact to anything else. even if it's proven to be a plant it doesn't move the path or if it came out of the Columbia.

when I see the placard can spiral downward vs drifting. it opens new windows for more explanations. it makes it harder to prove where and how it got there. we do know it's in the area of the path itself. if it was 5 miles west of the path we would now know it spiraled.

again, I'm not telling you anything. I'm not trying to discredit the theory. if anything I'm trying to resolve issues by doing simulations and testing theories. I'm going by known evidence and sorting it out. I will give my opinion based on what has been presented.

We're just going to have to agree to disagree about the placard. The thing drifted. It had no choice. It's simple physics. Even if Cooper no-pulled he would have drifted. This is why the search area extends to the northeast. The placard didn't drop from 40 feet, it dropped from 10,000 feet. Zero drift=no way in hell.

Regarding the tolerances, I understand that. I also understand that the 8:12 minute involves approximately 3 miles of movement along the path. That's a lot of real estate.

The jet crossed the river at 8:17 according to the FBI. Considering that they're going with an 8:11 drop time, that is way the hell off if he landed near PDX in the river.

In closing, what I do know is that nothing has been found where the FBI said stuff should be found.

You go against me with words when I actually showed what the card can do, really? you have all figured out...


I have nothing further to say...

Shutter, this isn't me saying this, the report I provided a link to above discusses this.

When you first spin the placard it cuts through the cross-wind like a saw until it enters a rotating wobbling kind of action. As the report states, regardless of how the placard (plate) is initially dropped, eventually it enters the same type of pattern. Moreover, it says as the speed of the object increases in velocity it increases its lift as well as "decreases" its drag, which they note is counter-intuitive but makes sense mathematically.

Either way, enough said on the subject.

I'd like to return to the subject of the revised LZ that Georger mentioned a few pages ago, based upon the FBI conference held several years after the skyjacking. What I read was that Orchard, WA - about 12 miles north of Portland - was the new launch point.

My question is: where do we now think Cooper landed? Yes, a little to the northeast of Orchard, but do we have any specificity? Georger, any thoughts? Anyone?

So, Shut, are you saying that the Orchards, WA launch point is the furthest south 305 could have traveled under the current time frames?

Further review: If Cooper deployed he would have drifted how far, exactly? 3-5 miles to the northeast? Winds were approximately 30 mph at 10,000 feet? Yes? That would have put Cooper in the Hockinson area, far to the south of Amboy/Ariel, et. al.

I'll be calling Tom McDowell soon, to hear what he has to say about this development. He was the commander of the search team for the Clark County Sheriff's Department.

Could be time for a new tromp in the woods....