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But don't give us this B.S. that Harold or the Ingrams realised quickly what they had - they didn't! By all accounts they had barely even heard about the Cooper case being new to the State.     

Please publish your interviews with the Ingrams so we may all share in your news?

 

I don't think I'm reaching here on this one.  I'm just looking at a calendar.

Ingram says they found the money in the afternoon on Sunday and the FBI showed up at the site on Tuesday.   Are my dates wrong?  The time between them finding the money and them contacting the FBI -- less than 24 hours -- would seem to qualify as pretty quickly.

You've expressed some skepticism with Dwayne's story.  Now, if you're suggesting he actually found the money sometime before February 10, then I might agree with you.   I know they tried bleaching the money and tried to figure out what to do with it before calling authorities, but unless my dates are wrong, I see that as "hours" not "days".

right - have it your way - YOU WILL ANYWAY.  Let the FBI know! They will amend their files to accommodate your theory of the day -

Uhhhhh ... have you considered your "theory" has implications? But what the hell. Who gives a shit at this point?
I dont..... radios .... gag me with a silver bucket!

Sorry, Georger.  I don't get where you're going with this.  But, I don't have anything to add, so I'm going to drop it.

Again, the actions of the Ingrams during and after the money find do not support the notion that they had fore-knowledge that they were looking for or even knew they had found, Cooper money. Basically all they knew was they had found some old money, perhaps lost at Tina Bar by somebody. Had they not contacted local law enforcement on Monday they might never have even called the FBI, but gone straight to a bank with the money, trying to redeem it, and this money might have been taken and passed through the system without ever being identified as belonging to the Cooper hijacking. In fact, one of the Ingrams has stated that it was the intercession of someone at Harold's workplace that advised Harold to call local law enforcement, that changed everything.. One speculation voiced was that the money might be connected to some area burglary or bank robbery in the past (and there might be a reward). Once Harold called local law enforcement things changed rather quickly, in everyone's understanding. Harold was apparently told that local law enforcement ( The Sheriff's office etc) did not keep serial number lists from area bank robberies and the like - that only the FBI kept such lists! As far as I know, having interviewed some of these people and the Ingrams, the name "Cooper" or "Cooper Hijacking" never came up. The reason for calling the FBI was because only the FBI kept lists of serial numbers et-cetera related to old bank robberies and the like. That was the reason for calling the FBI. So far as I know, nobody had mentioned the Cooper hijacking yet ...

Harold called the FBI straightaway and told them what he had found and where, and gave them several serial numbers off his found bills. The FBI advised Harold they would look into it and was told to call back later. The FBI did not call Harold back. Hearing nothing Harold finally called the FBI back later in the day and I believe it was Himmelsbach who came on the phone with Harold. After some conversation RH asked Harold if he would be willing to bring his findings in in the morning and Harold agreed. (Of course the FBI could have gone to find Harold immediately had they chosen to do that). Instead the FBI waited and Pat and Harold called the FBI back the next morning and confirmed a time to come in at the Federal Building in Portland. One of the Ingrams told me that it was during that conversation on the morning of the day the Ingrams came to the Federal Bldg that Harold was told his money might have some relationship to the Cooper Hijacking. According to a number of people Harold was shocked! The FBI had run the serial numbers Harold provided and a match with ransom money from the Cooper hijacking was certain. Then later that morning a news conference was held at the Federal Building.

Harold was never in a position to know what his found money meant, until he was informed by the FBI. Harold was also advised that the reward in the Cooper case had expired.
       

Thanks, Georger.

Let's just assume for a moment that Harold's drug dealer did know DB Cooper and a plan was hatched to send the dumb and expendable Ingrams out to Tina Bar, knowingly or unknowingly, to find Cooper money ... that's risky and inevitably somebody gets thrown under the bus ... all to convince the FBI Cooper is dead and get the Feds off Cooper's back forever! ?  A scheme like this could easily have backed up and thrown a drug dealer, his user clients, and Cooper himself into jail on Federal crimes. And in such a scheme Cooper himself wants to remain unknown and untouchable ?

A scheme like that is almost handing DB Cooper to the FBI, inevitably. For one thing, a scheme like that implies that Cooper is still alive directing matters and somewhere in the chain of players. Very likely the FBI would have been all over this convincing various people to give others up. I mean we are talking about a fairly small tightly knit group of conspirators here. It wouldn't take 2 minutes to have all of these people in jail spilling the beans on each other and willing to make deals ... all of which includes the players Pat Ingram, Crystal Ingram, Harold's brother, all of the kids, and all of Ingram's friends! All hatched by DB Cooper in order to convince the FBI he is dead?

And if Cooper is Radkstraw this puts Rackstraw at the level of a moron! 

My five year old grandson could come up with a better plan than that!

Colbert has just painted Cooper as a moron !  What a scheme like that lacks is a "comfort dog" explaining reality to all of the players?  So, where's the dog and what was it's name?    

 

 

Someone pulling a stunt like the one you describe would WANT to be caught.   Such an act would immediately take an active, but mostly likely slow single-agent FBI case and immediately throw agents, resources, attention and publicity on it.  AND involving people with not a lot of experience dealing with law enforcement who might not only spill the beans on the others, but crack under the stress of questioning and admit it themselves.  It makes no sense unless Cooper was, as Georger suggests, a moron, or someone that enjoyed being chased.

I don't live in that area, but you had relatives there, right, Georger?  GreyCop's book seems to imply there is a lot of urban legend that the Ingram's were directed where to find the money and it was Crystal who actually found it, and so on and so on.  Often, that's just speculation that turns into rumor that turns into legend.  Other times, someone does spill some beans in confidence and the story leaks out.  Have stories like this been out there since the money was found?

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proving that Cooper could have easily made contact with a ground assistant 60 or more miles away.

And maybe that's all Cooper needed.

Meyer

56% of all Americans and Wage Earner Sheeple believe that Trump will get to the bottom of the Cooper hijacking. Mr Colbert and RobertMBlevibns are already talking to the Trump campaign competing to be appointed Cooperland Czar. They intend to flush DB Cooper out from his retirement home in Utah, California, or Oregon ... with new incentives that will abolish the FBI and appoint the New Cooperland Czar over all Unsolved Crimes!   

You herd it here furst! 

______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

I just re-watched the "DB Cooper:Case Closed?" episode again.  What's all the fuss about -- they're all getting a hard one for this Rackstraw guy? It seems, to me, to be just another johnny-come-lately story again -- somebody (Colbert) has his pet suspect (Rackstraw) whom he will never let go as his guy, despite providing only circumstantial evidence, despite the FBI saying there just isn't any evidence to pursue the suspect.   In spite of it all, Colbert is sticking  to his story and his guy, come hell or high water.  All that work, time, and effort just to be turned away almost as fast as it came in.  No hard evidence -- like money, parachute, or a briefcase-- only circumstantial evidence was presented. 

.....Hold on...... I'm getting a deja vue -- I got this same feeling with Jo Weber (and Duane) and Robert Blevins (and RC) and others..... Maybe that's why I respect guys like Georger and R99 -- they like to work with facts, data, and real evidence.  Anything else is just speculation, and lord knows we've had our share of that!

Meyer

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But don't give us this B.S. that Harold or the Ingrams realised quickly what they had - they didn't! By all accounts they had barely even heard about the Cooper case being new to the State.     

Please publish your interviews with the Ingrams so we may all share in your news?

 

I don't think I'm reaching here on this one.  I'm just looking at a calendar.

Ingram says they found the money in the afternoon on Sunday and the FBI showed up at the site on Tuesday.   Are my dates wrong?  The time between them finding the money and them contacting the FBI -- less than 24 hours -- would seem to qualify as pretty quickly.

You've expressed some skepticism with Dwayne's story.  Now, if you're suggesting he actually found the money sometime before February 10, then I might agree with you.   I know they tried bleaching the money and tried to figure out what to do with it before calling authorities, but unless my dates are wrong, I see that as "hours" not "days".

right - have it your way - YOU WILL ANYWAY.  Let the FBI know! They will amend their files to accommodate your theory of the day -

Uhhhhh ... have you considered your "theory" has implications? But what the hell. Who gives a shit at this point?
I dont..... radios .... gag me with a silver bucket!

Sorry, Georger.  I don't get where you're going with this.  But, I don't have anything to add, so I'm going to drop it.

Again, the actions of the Ingrams during and after the money find do not support the notion that they had fore-knowledge that they were looking for or even knew they had found, Cooper money. Basically all they knew was they had found some old money, perhaps lost at Tina Bar by somebody. Had they not contacted local law enforcement on Monday they might never have even called the FBI, but gone straight to a bank with the money, trying to redeem it, and this money might have been taken and passed through the system without ever being identified as belonging to the Cooper hijacking. In fact, one of the Ingrams has stated that it was the intercession of someone at Harold's workplace that advised Harold to call local law enforcement, that changed everything.. One speculation voiced was that the money might be connected to some area burglary or bank robbery in the past (and there might be a reward). Once Harold called local law enforcement things changed rather quickly, in everyone's understanding. Harold was apparently told that local law enforcement ( The Sheriff's office etc) did not keep serial number lists from area bank robberies and the like - that only the FBI kept such lists! As far as I know, having interviewed some of these people and the Ingrams, the name "Cooper" or "Cooper Hijacking" never came up. The reason for calling the FBI was because only the FBI kept lists of serial numbers et-cetera related to old bank robberies and the like. That was the reason for calling the FBI. So far as I know, nobody had mentioned the Cooper hijacking yet ...

Harold called the FBI straightaway and told them what he had found and where, and gave them several serial numbers off his found bills. The FBI advised Harold they would look into it and was told to call back later. The FBI did not call Harold back. Hearing nothing Harold finally called the FBI back later in the day and I believe it was Himmelsbach who came on the phone with Harold. After some conversation RH asked Harold if he would be willing to bring his findings in in the morning and Harold agreed. (Of course the FBI could have gone to find Harold immediately had they chosen to do that). Instead the FBI waited and Pat and Harold called the FBI back the next morning and confirmed a time to come in at the Federal Building in Portland. One of the Ingrams told me that it was during that conversation on the morning of the day the Ingrams came to the Federal Bldg that Harold was told his money might have some relationship to the Cooper Hijacking. According to a number of people Harold was shocked! The FBI had run the serial numbers Harold provided and a match with ransom money from the Cooper hijacking was certain. Then later that morning a news conference was held at the Federal Building.

Harold was never in a position to know what his found money meant, until he was informed by the FBI. Harold was also advised that the reward in the Cooper case had expired.
       

Thanks, Georger.

Let's just assume for a moment that Harold's drug dealer did know DB Cooper and a plan was hatched to send the dumb and expendable Ingrams out to Tina Bar, knowingly or unknowingly, to find Cooper money ... that's risky and inevitably somebody gets thrown under the bus ... all to convince the FBI Cooper is dead and get the Feds off Cooper's back forever! ?  A scheme like this could easily have backed up and thrown a drug dealer, his user clients, and Cooper himself into jail on Federal crimes. And in such a scheme Cooper himself wants to remain unknown and untouchable ?

A scheme like that is almost handing DB Cooper to the FBI, inevitably. For one thing, a scheme like that implies that Cooper is still alive directing matters and somewhere in the chain of players. Very likely the FBI would have been all over this convincing various people to give others up. I mean we are talking about a fairly small tightly knit group of conspirators here. It wouldn't take 2 minutes to have all of these people in jail spilling the beans on each other and willing to make deals ... all of which includes the players Pat Ingram, Crystal Ingram, Harold's brother, all of the kids, and all of Ingram's friends! All hatched by DB Cooper in order to convince the FBI he is dead?

And if Cooper is Radkstraw this puts Rackstraw at the level of a moron! 

My five year old grandson could come up with a better plan than that!

Colbert has just painted Cooper as a moron !  What a scheme like that lacks is a "comfort dog" explaining reality to all of the players?  So, where's the dog and what was it's name?    

 

 

Someone pulling a stunt like the one you describe would WANT to be caught.   Such an act would immediately take an active, but mostly likely slow single-agent FBI case and immediately throw agents, resources, attention and publicity on it.  AND involving people with not a lot of experience dealing with law enforcement who might not only spill the beans on the others, but crack under the stress of questioning and admit it themselves.  It makes no sense unless Cooper was, as Georger suggests, a moron, or someone that enjoyed being chased.

I don't live in that area, but you had relatives there, right, Georger?  GreyCop's book seems to imply there is a lot of urban legend that the Ingram's were directed where to find the money and it was Crystal who actually found it, and so on and so on.  Often, that's just speculation that turns into rumor that turns into legend.  Other times, someone does spill some beans in confidence and the story leaks out.  Have stories like this been out there since the money was found?

Thanks Mark. Yes, there are morons who commit crimes but I dont see Cooper that way? Maybe its just my bias.

And 'yes', I asked my relatives if they knew the Ingrams, and I threw in a few other names ... the answer was no in each case. Frankly that came as a relief to me!    I wont go into details ...  The Ingrams probably feel the same..      all good fun.

There's no information suggesting Cooper was a sociopath ... or that radios were involved. Or that Marilyn Monroe was involved either.

Of course, there's no evidence to prove otherwise as well.

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There's no information suggesting Cooper was a sociopath ... or that radios were involved. Or that Marilyn Monroe was involved either.

Of course, there's no evidence to prove otherwise as well.

Well yes there is - you yourself cited it in another post on how well Cooper covered his tracks leaving no evidence. (Isnt this the 2nd or 3rd time you have posted this?)

Sociopathic personalities don't think in a straight line and seldom can eat a meal without some episodic interruption.

So now: he covered his tracks or he didn't? Which of your two opposing points of view do you now endorse?   

Okay, I'll agree with the sociopathic bit, but what about radios and Marilyn Monroe?

It is said Cooper asked for a 15d flap setting just prior to bailing. Snowmman looked at the Transcript and confirmed a 15d flap setting had been performed, but Snowmman discovered the last radioed flap setting was 30 degrees, not 15 degrees. Ordering flap settings has been taken as part of the evidence that Cooper might have been a pilot and its fair to say some people take this as "dead-sure evidence" Cooper was a pilot. Some people go further and say even knowing there was a 15-d flap setting on this 727 indicates Cooper had specialised knowledge about the 727, in any event. That about sums it up, I guess.

I believe Rataczak made the call for 30 degree flaps. the flap change occurred around 7 minutes (I believe) into the flight while Cooper was having trouble with the stairs. they were at 30 degree's for a short period after realizing it would burn more fuel...

Kaye vs. NWA Search Map:

Kaye argues strongly that Cooper bailed near Ariel, is correct -  and all other assertions are wrong - based on Kaye's personal analysis. See his website for his analysis. One of Kaye's assumptions/claims is the radar tracking of 305 was accurate.

One problem is: The FBI/NWA Search Map does not say what Kaye is saying.   

In fact, no document known says what Kaye is saying!

ps* I wont post the NWA document at issue because you all know it by heart by now.