Poll

Do you believe Cooper lived or died. the option are below to cast a vote...

0% Cooper lived
6 (9.4%)
25% Cooper lived
4 (6.3%)
35% Cooper lived.
2 (3.1%)
50% Cooper lived
14 (21.9%)
75% Cooper lived
14 (21.9%)
100 Cooper lived
24 (37.5%)

Total Members Voted: 59

Author Topic: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case  (Read 1830191 times)

Offline Shutter

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #825 on: July 19, 2015, 07:57:18 AM »
Quote
One might look for someone with a criminal record with metal production/metal working in his background, which would include even in a prison? A recently released person? A person assigned to a metal production facility post release?


That would be a very long list. which state, which year? hundreds released each year making for a long process. I think you would need the actual prison records to find out what jobs they were taking while in prison. then if they didn't get parole, or probation they  wouldn't have to report employment on the outside.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2015, 07:58:50 AM by Shutter »
 

Offline EVickiW

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #826 on: September 29, 2015, 12:36:54 AM »
Quote
The VORTEX works in mysterious ways.

377

Yes it does.

Mark Bennett and I had the pleasure of meeting with Bill Mitchell over lunch on Thursday, September 24, 2015. We spoke to him about the night of the hijacking. During our conversation he told us he had appeared on a British documentary in 2007.

If interested you can find the documentary at this link. You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts.
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #827 on: September 29, 2015, 02:47:36 AM »
Congratulations, Vicki and Mark! Hope you had a good time with Bill, and I'm glad that he's still talking to SOMEONE who posts here!!!

Also, the British docu was good to see. Certainly sums up the case circa 2007. And they were on to SOG, too!
 

Offline MarkBennett

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #828 on: September 29, 2015, 12:01:48 PM »
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The VORTEX works in mysterious ways.

377

Yes it does.

Mark Bennett and I had the pleasure of meeting with Bill Mitchell over lunch on Thursday, September 24, 2015. We spoke to him about the night of the hijacking. During our conversation he told us he had appeared on a British documentary in 2007.

If interested you can find the documentary at this link. You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Bill was very interesting.  I invited him to come on here and answer questions, but he prefers to lay low for now.

He hasn't done a lot of research on this case -- which is good in a way because it doesn't taint his own memories.  His take was definitely interesting.  He remembers the flight attendant carrying (not dragging) the money bag to the back of the plane.  However, he remembers it being Flo and not Tina.

He did say what we'd heard before about why he paid so much attention to Cooper's appearance.  Tina was a hot young flight attendant and wanted to know what this dumpy old guy had that was getting all of her attention.  I told him I thought Tina's description was good because she even noticed his socks.  Bill said he did too -- mostly that they didn't match his shoes.  He had brown socks and black shoes or vice versa.

He remembers getting off the plane a long way from the terminal.  After he did the FBI agent popped up and started reading off names.  He called "Mitchell" first, followed by "Cooper".  When Bill said "I think I sat across from that guy", the FBI took notice immediately.  He said the FBI came to the house many times.  His mother invited some people because it was a big deal.  There were nine people in the house the first time they came over.  Bill wondered if the FBI considered him as a suspect, but he said most of their visits involved showing him photos.

Vicki showed him a couple of photos while we were there.  I think it was Kenny and Lepsy she showed him.  At this point, he said, it's bits and pieces he remembers, so he couldn't say on those.

I think we know why Cooper held a grudge.  Cooper paid $20 for his ticket.  Mitchell walked up and paid only $13!   :) :) :)

What else, Vicki?
 

Robert99

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #829 on: September 29, 2015, 12:48:39 PM »
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I think we know why Cooper held a grudge.  Cooper paid $20 for his ticket.  Mitchell walked up and paid only $13!   :) :) :)


Mitchell apparently got the student stand-by rate for the flight. ;D
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #830 on: September 29, 2015, 02:31:32 PM »
Price was bumped 35%
 

Offline EVickiW

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #831 on: September 29, 2015, 03:43:29 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Quote
The VORTEX works in mysterious ways.

377

Yes it does.

Mark Bennett and I had the pleasure of meeting with Bill Mitchell over lunch on Thursday, September 24, 2015. We spoke to him about the night of the hijacking. During our conversation he told us he had appeared on a British documentary in 2007.

If interested you can find the documentary at this link. You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Bill was very interesting.  I invited him to come on here and answer questions, but he prefers to lay low for now.

He hasn't done a lot of research on this case -- which is good in a way because it doesn't taint his own memories.  His take was definitely interesting.  He remembers the flight attendant carrying (not dragging) the money bag to the back of the plane.  However, he remembers it being Flo and not Tina.

He did say what we'd heard before about why he paid so much attention to Cooper's appearance.  Tina was a hot young flight attendant and wanted to know what this dumpy old guy had that was getting all of her attention.  I told him I thought Tina's description was good because she even noticed his socks.  Bill said he did too -- mostly that they didn't match his shoes.  He had brown socks and black shoes or vice versa.

He remembers getting off the plane a long way from the terminal.  After he did the FBI agent popped up and started reading off names.  He called "Mitchell" first, followed by "Cooper".  When Bill said "I think I sat across from that guy", the FBI took notice immediately.  He said the FBI came to the house many times.  His mother invited some people because it was a big deal.  There were nine people in the house the first time they came over.  Bill wondered if the FBI considered him as a suspect, but he said most of their visits involved showing him photos.

Vicki showed him a couple of photos while we were there.  I think it was Kenny and Lepsy she showed him.  At this point, he said, it's bits and pieces he remembers, so he couldn't say on those.

I think we know why Cooper held a grudge.  Cooper paid $20 for his ticket.  Mitchell walked up and paid only $13!   :) :) :)

What else, Vicki?

He remembers using the aft stairs to get on the plane and took his seat to the left. When they deplaned they went out the front to a staircase.
When asked to move to the front of the plane, he did not go right away. Flo came back and asked him to move in a pleading voice.
He does not remember when Cooper sat down or if he was there when he sat down. He only noticed him when Tina started paying attention to him.
The FBI sketch is not accurate to his memory. He thought Cooper looked older.
Cooper kept reaching into the briefcase with his right hand. The briefcase was on the window seat. Cooper in the middle and Tina on the aisle.
The ticket agent was the one who wrote Bill's name on the ticket. I held the original white "passenger coupon". The name and info on the flight were written in red pen and the typed information was in red ink. (Really cool)  :P

I am sure there is more........   8)
 
« Last Edit: September 29, 2015, 03:49:01 PM by EVickiW »
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Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #832 on: September 29, 2015, 04:27:25 PM »
Ah, delightful. Thanks, Vicki and Mark.

Glad Bill is talking to someone. Sigh. Guess I learned a hard lesson.
 

Offline 377

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #833 on: September 29, 2015, 07:05:20 PM »
Mitchell thought the FBI sketch wasn't accurate, Cooper looked older, dumpy, not style conscious, "turkey gobble" neck.

Many regard the FBI sketch as a near photograph of Cooper. It could be waaaay off base.  Mitchell doesn't think its a good match. Just sayin...

When I did criminal defense work I saw composites that eyewitnesses confidently verified. In some cases they proved to be WILDLY inaccurate. height, weight, eye color, all wrong.

377
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #834 on: September 29, 2015, 08:14:46 PM »
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Mitchell thought the FBI sketch wasn't accurate, Cooper looked older, dumpy, not style conscious, "turkey gobble" neck.

Many regard the FBI sketch as a near photograph of Cooper. It could be waaaay off base.  Mitchell doesn't think its a good match. Just sayin...

When I did criminal defense work I saw composites that eyewitnesses confidently verified. In some cases they proved to be WILDLY inaccurate. height, weight, eye color, all wrong.

377


Did they spend hours, or seconds looking at the bad guy? most crimes don't last hours, and most only have a minute or so to recall the guy...I'll bet the description is pretty good over the photo...
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #835 on: September 29, 2015, 08:17:40 PM »
Mitchell seems to have had his own grudge. he didn't like the attention the old guy was getting...

Tina was in her 20's....what would they consider an "old guy" to be at? 30, 40, 50+...
« Last Edit: September 29, 2015, 08:18:11 PM by Shutter »
 

Offline MarkBennett

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #836 on: September 29, 2015, 08:36:17 PM »
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Ah, delightful. Thanks, Vicki and Mark.

Glad Bill is talking to someone. Sigh. Guess I learned a hard lesson.

Yep....Bill didn't want to be pulled into all of the Cooper craziness.

He said the FBI asked him if he knew the plane was being hijacked, and if he had known, would he have done anything about it.

He said he didn't know, and even if he had, he wouldn't have done anything.
 

Offline EVickiW

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #837 on: September 29, 2015, 08:42:49 PM »
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Mitchell thought the FBI sketch wasn't accurate, Cooper looked older, dumpy, not style conscious, "turkey gobble" neck.

Many regard the FBI sketch as a near photograph of Cooper. It could be waaaay off base.  Mitchell doesn't think its a good match. Just sayin...

When I did criminal defense work I saw composites that eyewitnesses confidently verified. In some cases they proved to be WILDLY inaccurate. height, weight, eye color, all wrong.

377

Florence also disagreed about the accuracy of the composite. Florence Schaffner appeared on a 1988 episode of Unsolved Mysteries and a new sketch (attached) was drawn under her direction.
You are entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts.
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #838 on: September 29, 2015, 09:39:47 PM »
It appears that two people disagree with the original sketch...or is it 3? didn't the ticket agent say the sketch was off?

The description is pretty consistent from several people. you see a break down in the description with the passengers. they didn't have a reason to remember him, or briefly noticed him which is consistent with an average crime where they don't have a lot of time to get a good physical description.

Vicki, did you ask Bill what he thought of Flo's sketch?
I wonder what the other two stews think of Flo's sketch?

Someone taller than 6' 1" would be getting close to the top of the cabin, so I doubt he was taller. If he was shorter than the Stews, I think they would of pointed this out, so I believe the 5' 10 - 6' is pretty accurate. they also were pretty close with the weight. the cabin height is 88.3 inches, or 7' 3"
« Last Edit: September 29, 2015, 09:40:20 PM by Shutter »
 

Offline EVickiW

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #839 on: September 29, 2015, 09:43:38 PM »
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It appears that two people disagree with the original sketch...or is it 3? didn't the ticket agent say the sketch was off?

The description is pretty consistent from several people. you see a break down in the description with the passengers. they didn't have a reason to remember him, or briefly noticed him which is consistent with an average crime where they don't have a lot of time to get a good physical description.

Vicki, did you ask Bill what he thought of Flo's sketch?
I wonder what the other two stews think of Flo's sketch?

Someone taller than 6' 1" would be getting close to the top of the cabin, so I doubt he was taller. If he was shorter than the Stews, I think they would of pointed this out, so I believe the 5' 10 - 6' is pretty accurate. they also were pretty close with the weight. the cabin height is 88.3 inches, or 7' 3"

I did not ask him. We are sending emails back and forth. I will work it into the conversation. I already asked what his interpretation of "older" was and he has not replied.
You are entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts.