Poll

Do you believe Cooper lived or died. the option are below to cast a vote...

0% Cooper lived
6 (9.5%)
25% Cooper lived
4 (6.3%)
35% Cooper lived.
2 (3.2%)
50% Cooper lived
14 (22.2%)
75% Cooper lived
14 (22.2%)
100 Cooper lived
23 (36.5%)

Total Members Voted: 58

Author Topic: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case  (Read 1562179 times)

Offline snowmman

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3600 on: October 24, 2018, 02:23:20 PM »

Sailshaw posted dates that were wrong.
I wonder if you got a wrong date from Sailshaw
Specifically Sailshaw posted "Ginger Lucena Peterson" as Sheridan's daughter. While she is 46 and born in 1972, her birthday isn't Halloween 1972

So Sailshaw was wrong about that and I assume Sailshaw could be equally wrong about Sheridan Jr.

How did you determine Sheridan Jr's phone number and that he was the correct Sheridan?

I've not been able to find Ginger. I want to get Bruce to interview her. I think Bruce does a reasonable wide-ranging job and has a warmer interview style.


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EU

Where did you get Sheridan Jr's birthday from?

Off the top of my head I cannot remember. I believe I've read it in a few places. Sheridan may also have mentioned it to me.
 

Offline snowmman

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3601 on: October 24, 2018, 02:32:59 PM »
I find reading about Sheridan's family fascinating

His grandfather Sheridan was a big man in the area. Ran for office, had a big orchard.
His father Chauncey, went off to World War I. I think he was in France for a short time. Leading a unit as captain if I remember. Got gassed. Made it back and led up the local National Guard unit. Had a back injury while taking a train with the unit to San Francisco. Stepped down as leader of the unit shortly after that.

Sheridan said his father had medals and stuff in the living room.

The father left the family at some point. I found a work permit for him in WA working in an orchard. Maybe I was wrong. In any case Sheridan says he was deceased in his Boeing application. I found a mention of Chauncey being deceased in the grandfather's obit (Sheridan).

So I'm not sure if Sheridan really knew his father had died somewhere, or whether that was just a family story.

Sheridan likes to talk about rumors that his Dad went to China to train troops, and that he even looked for traces of that when he traveled in China.
But none of that seems to be true.

I can imagine as a kid, he was intimidated by the family stories from his dad and grandfather. Hard to live up to.

Then the whole incident with "accidently" shooting his brother Alden (shotgun was it?) Bruce reported this with his Alden interview back in the day.
I guess he was sent off to reform school sometime after that.

Sheridan has written a lot about how traumatic reform school was, and how he had to fight to defend his position.

There's been some rants/discussions I've had with him where  he mentioned pedophilia amongst the teachers, but I think that's just a blanket rant from Sheridan about those teachers and maybe general societal issues being reported about those kinds of institutions.

Basically, he had a pretty rough childhood, IMO
« Last Edit: October 24, 2018, 02:34:55 PM by snowmman »
 

Offline 377

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3602 on: October 24, 2018, 02:41:05 PM »
He had a horrible childhood which included severe beatings. I have heard about it in person and could see the pain in his telling about it. Love and kindness seemed to have been in short supply during much of his childhood. Tragic really. It still haunts and shapes him.

377
 

Offline 377

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3603 on: October 24, 2018, 02:42:47 PM »
Ginger lives in San Francisco. Don't have an address though. She cares about her father and he about her.

377
 

Offline snowmman

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3604 on: October 24, 2018, 02:47:45 PM »
rereading Sheridan's June 2011 stuff when he finally got on Dropzone.com
I was so pissed at how people chased him off then, after all of 377's work coaxing him onto the site.

I see now, from this post, that he says "Several years ago I was quite chagrin to learn that Bruce Smith had phoned my brother and crazy sister-in-law and printed their conversations on this site"

So Sheridan was tracking DZ.com? Because he said "several years ago"...not that he had searched recently in 2011

The Alden interview Sheridan speaks of was Feb 11, 2010, so just one year prior.

He then makes the funniest slam of his brother and sister-in law

"Alden and Barbara are winos. They've been winos for a long time. It sounds as if they were drunk when you called them. Ten years ago they consumed several gallons of an evening. The kind that comes in a box. Barbara has bipolar disorder.

Please leave my daughter alone. She has been a real nightmare. She is schizophrenic and is in a mental health facility. She is why I came down here from Deer Park. At the present she's disappear. I am in great distress"


Sheridan ends the post saying

Carr and Smith are FBI I assume

Enough said.

 

Offline snowmman

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3605 on: October 24, 2018, 02:49:26 PM »
How did you find this out? Have you ever had a conversation with Ginger?

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Ginger lives in San Francisco. Don't have an address though. She cares about her father and he about her.

377
 

Offline EU

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3606 on: October 24, 2018, 02:56:15 PM »
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Sailshaw posted dates that were wrong.
I wonder if you got a wrong date from Sailshaw
Specifically Sailshaw posted "Ginger Lucena Peterson" as Sheridan's daughter. While she is 46 and born in 1972, her birthday isn't Halloween 1972

So Sailshaw was wrong about that and I assume Sailshaw could be equally wrong about Sheridan Jr.

How did you determine Sheridan Jr's phone number and that he was the correct Sheridan?

I've not been able to find Ginger. I want to get Bruce to interview her. I think Bruce does a reasonable wide-ranging job and has a warmer interview style.


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EU

Where did you get Sheridan Jr's birthday from?

Off the top of my head I cannot remember. I believe I've read it in a few places. Sheridan may also have mentioned it to me.

I'm not sure whether you're questioning Ginger's birthday being on Halloween 1972 or Sail is. Nonetheless, it was on Halloween 1972 per Sheridan's comment below.
Some men see things as they are, and ask why? I dream of things that never were, and ask why not?

RFK
 

Offline snowmman

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3607 on: October 24, 2018, 02:57:41 PM »
When Pete offered this odd thing out of the blue in his first post

My nick name for much of my adult life was Pete, not Dan

Orange1, being the smart, way honed, woman she is, immediately picked up on it and asked the obvious question

Orange1 said:
When you say "My nick name for much of my adult life was Pete, not Dan"
...does this mean you were known as Dan for some (presumably earlier part) of your adult life?


Sheridan didn't answer (the crowd with pitchforks and torches ran him off, namely Jerry and skyjack71)

 
 

Offline EU

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3608 on: October 24, 2018, 03:00:44 PM »
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rereading Sheridan's June 2011 stuff when he finally got on Dropzone.com
I was so pissed at how people chased him off then, after all of 377's work coaxing him onto the site.

I see now, from this post, that he says "Several years ago I was quite chagrin to learn that Bruce Smith had phoned my brother and crazy sister-in-law and printed their conversations on this site"

So Sheridan was tracking DZ.com? Because he said "several years ago"...not that he had searched recently in 2011

The Alden interview Sheridan speaks of was Feb 11, 2010, so just one year prior.

He then makes the funniest slam of his brother and sister-in law

"Alden and Barbara are winos. They've been winos for a long time. It sounds as if they were drunk when you called them. Ten years ago they consumed several gallons of an evening. The kind that comes in a box. Barbara has bipolar disorder.

Please leave my daughter alone. She has been a real nightmare. She is schizophrenic and is in a mental health facility. She is why I came down here from Deer Park. At the present she's disappear. I am in great distress"


Sheridan ends the post saying

Carr and Smith are FBI I assume

Enough said.


You may also note that one of the more interesting characters in Sheridan's book--who he obviously despises--is the Ivy League guy with the black tie from Massachusetts named Alden Wordsworth-Adams. Interesting that he uses Alden as the guy's name just like the brother he despises.
Some men see things as they are, and ask why? I dream of things that never were, and ask why not?

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Offline snowmman

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3609 on: October 24, 2018, 03:24:40 PM »
Has anyone else had any discussion with Sheridan about whether his nickname was "Dan" for a time?

I just remembered this issue,  while re-reading Sheridan's 2011 DZ.com postings.

Although I've always hated the "Dan Cooper" comic book thing, it would be funny if in his early skydiving days his nickname was Dan and anyone randomly called him Dan Cooper because of the comic book.
 

Offline snowmman

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3610 on: October 24, 2018, 03:41:34 PM »
In the bar scene in his book where Vince Grecco (Sheridan) almost gets in a fight with a military guy over a woman, the guy who held Vince back was named Joon Pak, a Korean exchange student.

Same first name as the guy who held Sheridan back when he was almost in a fight with Sailshaw. And Korean..I forget if he was an exchange student.

He likes to talk about that episode nowadays...to slam Sailshaw

But yeah, he works his personal life details into everything.

oh here's the detail Sheridan has relayed to me about that supposed almost-fight with Sailshaw

I only spoke to him about renting a basement apartment which I suppose was intended as a garage but was too damp for a car. Sailshaw was distraught about a gal he had broken up with because she was too independent. When I returned to pick up my deposit he was like a raving lunatic. Joon Lee stepped betwween us and urged me to forget about the deposit

heh. In Sheridan's telling, both stories involve a woman.

Now that I ponder it, here's the amazing thing.

Sheridan writes the scene with Joon the Korean student, in his book, way before Sailshaw arrived on the scene, talking about Sheridan's time with him. Somehow that episode with Sailshaw stuck in his brain, even before Sailshaw started posting on the internet about Sheridan after finding our mentions of Sheridan at DZ.com.

Sheridan sure fixates on certain things.

Having copy/paste problems again here, so can't include the Joon Pak passage from the book. Snip attached instead

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rereading Sheridan's June 2011 stuff when he finally got on Dropzone.com
I was so pissed at how people chased him off then, after all of 377's work coaxing him onto the site.

I see now, from this post, that he says "Several years ago I was quite chagrin to learn that Bruce Smith had phoned my brother and crazy sister-in-law and printed their conversations on this site"

So Sheridan was tracking DZ.com? Because he said "several years ago"...not that he had searched recently in 2011

The Alden interview Sheridan speaks of was Feb 11, 2010, so just one year prior.

He then makes the funniest slam of his brother and sister-in law

"Alden and Barbara are winos. They've been winos for a long time. It sounds as if they were drunk when you called them. Ten years ago they consumed several gallons of an evening. The kind that comes in a box. Barbara has bipolar disorder.

Please leave my daughter alone. She has been a real nightmare. She is schizophrenic and is in a mental health facility. She is why I came down here from Deer Park. At the present she's disappear. I am in great distress"


Sheridan ends the post saying

Carr and Smith are FBI I assume

Enough said.


You may also note that one of the more interesting characters in Sheridan's book--who he obviously despises--is the Ivy League guy with the black tie from Massachusetts named Alden Wordsworth-Adams. Interesting that he uses Alden as the guy's name just like the brother he despises.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2018, 03:43:02 PM by snowmman »
 

Offline georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3611 on: October 24, 2018, 03:42:51 PM »
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Has anyone else had any discussion with Sheridan about whether his nickname was "Dan" for a time?

I just remembered this issue,  while re-reading Sheridan's 2011 DZ.com postings.

Although I've always hated the "Dan Cooper" comic book thing, it would be funny if in his early skydiving days his nickname was Dan and anyone randomly called him Dan Cooper because of the comic book.

Has it occurred to anyone that Sheridan has gone a long way toward talking himself into being cooper, even if he wasn't! If his dna didn't measure up, I would drop this guy like a hot rock ... classed as a pretender.  He may be a pretender milking a myth which social media personalities are only too happy to play with... forever!  :))
« Last Edit: October 24, 2018, 03:44:10 PM by georger »
 

Offline snowmman

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3612 on: October 24, 2018, 03:46:57 PM »
Sure of course georger.

Which is why for the past 10 years, we've only said  ummph, worth keeping this guy on the radar.

Now if someone was Cooper and alive today, how would you expect him to act?

In my twisted mind, Sheridan's behavior is reasonable for either being Cooper or not being Cooper

EU is the one who wants to claim A proves Z.  Not me. I just have things that bother me.
It's so weird that a 92 year old guy can spool me and others up

Sure he's playing us. Isn't that cool, no matter what? Good for him...I wish I knew him in his younger years. Or someone who knew him in his younger years.

For instance, I'd rather talk to him than you, georger!
 

Offline snowmman

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3613 on: October 24, 2018, 04:17:08 PM »

(I wonder if my copy/paste problems have to do with accented chars, or tab chars. Yes. I filtered and fixed it. will post details about the bug later)

Okay, here is what it looks like when I speculate
Ten years ago, I speculated to 377 that Sheridan chose the phrase "The Idiot's Frightful Laughter" because he identified with the author/poet Arthur Rimbaud...his life story, all sorts of bits of it.

Which EU, is why I posted that poem to DZ.com back in the day.

from my 2008 notes:

The title is "The Idiot's Frightful Laughter".

This line is apparently from the french prose (english translation) of the first prose poem in the book "A Season in Hell" by Arthur Rimbaud. it is referred to as "Once, if my memory served me well..."

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The line is:

"And spring brought me the idiot's frightful laughter."

Although different translations may use different English words. A good background of what drove Rimbaud to write "A Season In Hell" is very instructive, and Sheridan may have identified with the torment and release?

A good background of "A Season in Hell" is at

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Note the Belgian connection.

" The book was published in October at the Belgian printer Jacques Poot and Co and Arthur went to Brussels to take some copies. He left one signed specimen for Verlaine in prison. He gave one to Delahaye, one to Millot, another friend of Charleville and sent 3 or 4 of them to Forain, for himself and for Parisian friends. He also went to Paris, but because of his bad reputation and the scandal of Brussels, his old acquaintances avoided him.

Back to Roche, disgusted, he burnt the last copies he has with some rough works, letters and papers, in the fireplace in front of his mother and his sister Isabelle. Being unable to pay for the printer, he abandoned the edition of his book so five-hundred other specimens were found in 1901 in the printing works warehouse by Leon Losseau, a Belgian scholar."

A nice bio of Rimbaud is here

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The Rimbaud bio seems to match Sheridan's early life, very well. Sheridan may have identified with these details. Rimbaud had a homosexual lover. Here are snippets of the bio, but all of it (above) is good

Rimbaud was born Jean Nicolas Arthur Rimbaud in Charleville, France, near the Belgian border, on October 20, 1854. His parents were Frederic Rimbaud, an army captain, and Marie-Catherine-Vitalie Cuif Rimbaud, a landed peasant. There were three other children in the family: Frederic, born in 1853; Vitalie, born in 1858; and Isabelle, born in 1860. When Rimbaud was six years old, his parents separated, and the boy was raised by his stern, overprotective, and devoutly Christian mother. He attended the College de Charleville, where he was an outstanding student in every subject, but he was permitted no contact with other boys outside school hours by his mother who insisted on accompanying him to and from school each day. Georges Izambard, a professor at the school, befriended Rimbaud and encouraged him to read the poetry of the Romantics and the Parnassians, and to write his own poetry. Izambard left the school in 1870 at the outbreak of the Franco-Prussian war, and over the next two years Rimbaud ran away from home on three different occasions, at least once in an attempt to find his mentor. Some critics, citing the abrupt change in the tone of his poetry during this period, speculate that Rimbaud may have experienced a traumatic event "possibly sexual abuse by soldiers" during the months he spent in Paris and Belgium. The sentimental verse of his earlier years gave way to poetry that expressed his growing cynicism and disgust with life.
..
Also in 1871, he wrote to the poet Paul Verlaine, enclosing some samples of his verse. At Verlaine's urging, Rimbaud went to Paris and took up residence with Verlaine and his wife. Rimbaud's antisocial behavior and the developing sexual relationship between the two poets all but destroyed Verlaine's marriage.
..
Rimbaud, who was studying Eastern religion and alchemy, existing on very little sleep, and taking hallucinogenic drugs, experienced a period of intense creative activity during this time. However, his relationship with Verlaine became more and more volatile and when he tried to end the affair, Verlaine shot him in the wrist. Rimbaud retreated to his mother's home in Roche, near Charleville, and finished Une Saison en enfer (1873; A Season in Hell), while Verlaine spent the next two years at hard labor in a Belgian prison.

Deciding to become an adventurer, Rimbaud traveled throughout Europe and Africa, finally settling in Abyssinia, Ethiopia, where he worked for many years as a gunrunner and possibly as a slave trader.

« Last Edit: October 24, 2018, 04:20:50 PM by snowmman »
 

Offline EU

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3614 on: October 24, 2018, 04:24:30 PM »
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(I wonder if my copy/paste has to do with accented chars, or tab chars)

Okay, here is what it looks like when I speculate
Ten years ago, I speculated to 377 that Sheridan chose the phrase "The Idiot's Frightful Laughter" because he identified with the author/poet Arthur Rimbaud...his life story, all sorts of bits of it.

Which EU, is why I posted that poem to DZ.com back in the day.

from my 2008 notes:

The title is "The Idiot's Frightful Laughter".

This line is apparently from the french prose (english translation) of the first prose poem in the book "A Season in Hell" by Arthur Rimbaud. it is referred to as "Once, if my memory served me well..."

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

The line is:

"And spring brought me the idiot's frightful laughter."

Although different translations may use different English words. A good background of what drove Rimbaud to write "A Season In Hell" is very instructive, and Sheridan may have identified with the torment and release?

A good background of "A Season in Hell" is at

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Note the Belgian connection.

" The book was published in October at the Belgian printer Jacques Poot and Co and Arthur went to Brussels to take some copies. He left one signed specimen for Verlaine in prison. He gave one to Delahaye, one to Millot, another friend of Charleville and sent 3 or 4 of them to Forain, for himself and for Parisian friends. He also went to Paris, but because of his bad reputation and the scandal of Brussels, his old acquaintances avoided him.

Back to Roche, disgusted, he burnt the last copies he has with some rough works, letters and papers, in the fireplace in front of his mother and his sister Isabelle. Being unable to pay for the printer, he abandoned the edition of his book so five-hundred other specimens were found in 1901 in the printing works warehouse by Leon Losseau, a Belgian scholar."

A nice bio of Rimbaud is here

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

The Rimbaud bio seems to match Sheridan's early life, very well. Sheridan may have identified with these details. Rimbaud had a homosexual lover. Here are snippets of the bio, but all of it (above) is good

Rimbaud was born Jean Nicolas Arthur Rimbaud in Charleville, France, near the Belgian border, on October 20, 1854. His parents were Frederic Rimbaud, an army captain, and Marie-Catherine-Vitalie Cuif Rimbaud, a landed peasant. There were three other children in the family: Frederic, born in 1853; Vitalie, born in 1858; and Isabelle, born in 1860. When Rimbaud was six years old, his parents separated, and the boy was raised by his stern, overprotective, and devoutly Christian mother. He attended the College de Charleville, where he was an outstanding student in every subject, but he was permitted no contact with other boys outside school hours by his mother who insisted on accompanying him to and from school each day. Georges Izambard, a professor at the school, befriended Rimbaud and encouraged him to read the poetry of the Romantics and the Parnassians, and to write his own poetry. Izambard left the school in 1870 at the outbreak of the Franco-Prussian war, and over the next two years Rimbaud ran away from home on three different occasions, at least once in an attempt to find his mentor. Some critics, citing the abrupt change in the tone of his poetry during this period, speculate that Rimbaud may have experienced a traumatic event "possibly sexual abuse by soldiers" during the months he spent in Paris and Belgium. The sentimental verse of his earlier years gave way to poetry that expressed his growing cynicism and disgust with life.
..
Also in 1871, he wrote to the poet Paul Verlaine, enclosing some samples of his verse. At Verlaine's urging, Rimbaud went to Paris and took up residence with Verlaine and his wife. Rimbaud's antisocial behavior and the developing sexual relationship between the two poets all but destroyed Verlaine's marriage.
..
Rimbaud, who was studying Eastern religion and alchemy, existing on very little sleep, and taking hallucinogenic drugs, experienced a period of intense creative activity during this time. However, his relationship with Verlaine became more and more volatile and when he tried to end the affair, Verlaine shot him in the wrist. Rimbaud retreated to his mother's home in Roche, near Charleville, and finished Une Saison en enfer (1873; A Season in Hell), while Verlaine spent the next two years at hard labor in a Belgian prison.

Deciding to become an adventurer, Rimbaud traveled throughout Europe and Africa, finally settling in Abyssinia, Ethiopia, where he worked for many years as a gunrunner and possibly as a slave trader.

I concur. I have talked at length with 377 about Sheridan and what appears to be the two distinct personalities of the man. The poem could have been written by Sheridan himself given that it describes him and his place in life as it stands today so well. The bio makes it that much more intriguing.
Some men see things as they are, and ask why? I dream of things that never were, and ask why not?

RFK