Poll

Do you believe Cooper lived or died. the option are below to cast a vote...

0% Cooper lived
6 (9.5%)
25% Cooper lived
4 (6.3%)
35% Cooper lived.
2 (3.2%)
50% Cooper lived
14 (22.2%)
75% Cooper lived
14 (22.2%)
100 Cooper lived
23 (36.5%)

Total Members Voted: 58

Author Topic: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case  (Read 1674594 times)

Offline snowmman

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3330 on: October 20, 2018, 12:54:56 AM »
because in 1980 there was a need to explain rubber bands because of what the Ingrams said.

the attempt was made, but the execution was poor and not aligned with existing fbi memos.

There was no need to have a rubber band story before 1980.
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3331 on: October 20, 2018, 12:55:07 AM »
I haven't seen a "memo" stating bills were randomly packed..

similar to "Office Space"

didn't you get the memo?
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3332 on: October 20, 2018, 12:57:38 AM »
No need for a hijacking in 1971? many claim there was a reason for it...a Government reason...I didn't get that memo either?
 

Offline georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3333 on: October 20, 2018, 01:03:33 AM »
well at least we are talking about it and throwing ideas/opinions around.  :congrats:
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3334 on: October 20, 2018, 01:04:34 AM »
I'm not sure about anything...what I don't like is someone trying to imply differently...
 

FLYJACK

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3335 on: October 20, 2018, 10:15:38 AM »
The entire process to create that FBI ransom bill list was sketchy...

The FBI was having difficulty deducting the $30k in $20 bills from the 15 pairs of start/stop numbers and requested all the 1500 bill numbers that did not go to Cooper. The bank had made a new emergency ransom fund and used the $30k in $20 bills in the new fund. That new 2nd micro was sent to the FBI with ranges of bills to deduct but the new range didn't match the original range...
 

FLYJACK

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3336 on: October 20, 2018, 10:54:26 AM »
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so Himmelsbach is saying the straps disappeared, yet rubber bands surrounding strapped bundles, stayed in some form?

Is the implication that the 3 bundles were encircled by rubber bands holding together, yet crumbling?

If so, why did Ingrams say 3 bundles?

no bundle was that different from 100 bills...So what exactly did the rubber bands encircle?

It is simple... if you realize the difference between bundles and packets.

The 3 "packets" would have been individually strapped in 100 bills, then "bundled" together using rubber bands.

The paper bands would deteriorate rapidly and as the rubber bands deteriorated the 3 "packets" separated slightly. "Random sized" bundles = random number of packets (x 100 bills) per bundle - to make look hastily prepared.

something like this..
« Last Edit: October 20, 2018, 11:03:53 AM by FLYJACK »
 

Offline snowmman

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3337 on: October 20, 2018, 12:12:41 PM »
yeah I was looking at examples too
It seems the natural way is two sets of bands..not in the middle.
and thin vs thick bands is a thing. thin bands doubled or not.
another technique is additional bands lengthwise. see attached variations

3 packets seems like a small number though to band?
 

Offline snowmman

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3338 on: October 20, 2018, 12:16:52 PM »
So the theory is that rubber bands don't decompose as fast as currency straps?
That rubber bands would stay around, but currency straps wouldn't?

I thought the thinking was that rubber bands last a year or two?

Currency straps disappear from a rubber banded bundle in less than that time?
 

FLYJACK

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3339 on: October 20, 2018, 12:31:15 PM »
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So the theory is that rubber bands don't decompose as fast as currency straps?
That rubber bands would stay around, but currency straps wouldn't?

I thought the thinking was that rubber bands last a year or two?

Currency straps disappear from a rubber banded bundle in less than that time?

100% Paper bands in that environment would deteriorate quickly, months. Rubber bands lose their elasticity quick but would deteriorate slowly for many years, perhaps a decade.
 

Offline snowmman

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3340 on: October 20, 2018, 12:44:58 PM »
That theory about disappearing currency straps in a rubber banded bundle should have been what Kaye tested when he put rubber bands under sand/water for a year.

It's an interesting question: can you lose all trace of currency straps, but retain rubber band debris in a bundle of strapped bills..

don't know.
 

FLYJACK

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3341 on: October 20, 2018, 01:19:03 PM »
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That theory about disappearing currency straps in a rubber banded bundle should have been what Kaye tested when he put rubber bands under sand/water for a year.

It's an interesting question: can you lose all trace of currency straps, but retain rubber band debris in a bundle of strapped bills..

don't know.

I believe so, but it would depend on how long the money was in that wet environment.

Different papers have different rates, the thinner and wetter the faster.. estimates range from 2 - 5 months. Many different processes breakdown the cellulosic fibres.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2018, 01:29:38 PM by FLYJACK »
 

Offline georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3342 on: October 20, 2018, 01:40:35 PM »
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That theory about disappearing currency straps in a rubber banded bundle should have been what Kaye tested when he put rubber bands under sand/water for a year.

It's an interesting question: can you lose all trace of currency straps, but retain rubber band debris in a bundle of strapped bills..

don't know.

No - absolutely not! Some trace of paper bands would exist. For one thing paper bands take up far more area than a rubber band. The paper straps add their own chemical signature ... to the surface of a bill. A shadow of a strap might have turned up when they did the silver nitrate testing of some of the bills. A shadow of a strap would turn up under any number of types of testing. FLYJACK knows that - he's just adjusting reality for his own convenience.  Recall for a second that Flyjack is also a self confessed particle physics expert who has commented at length about Tom's particle list etiology! It's all so very convenient.  :D
 

Offline georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3343 on: October 20, 2018, 01:45:55 PM »
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That theory about disappearing currency straps in a rubber banded bundle should have been what Kaye tested when he put rubber bands under sand/water for a year.

It's an interesting question: can you lose all trace of currency straps, but retain rubber band debris in a bundle of strapped bills..

don't know.

I believe so, but it would depend on how long the money was in that wet environment.

Different papers have different rates, the thinner and wetter the faster.. estimates range from 2 - 5 months. Many different processes breakdown the cellulosic fibres.

What is a "cellulosic fibre" ?    Is that like a "metalosic" spoon ?  Or a "Cheetolosic" cracker?

It just gets more sublime and crazier/artificial every day!  A " cellulosic " tree ?   :rofl:
« Last Edit: October 20, 2018, 01:51:25 PM by georger »
 

FLYJACK

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #3344 on: October 20, 2018, 02:18:33 PM »
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That theory about disappearing currency straps in a rubber banded bundle should have been what Kaye tested when he put rubber bands under sand/water for a year.

It's an interesting question: can you lose all trace of currency straps, but retain rubber band debris in a bundle of strapped bills..

don't know.

No - absolutely not! Some trace of paper bands would exist. For one thing paper bands take up far more area than a rubber band. The paper straps add their own chemical signature ... to the surface of a bill. A shadow of a strap might have turned up when they did the silver nitrate testing of some of the bills. A shadow of a strap would turn up under any number of types of testing. FLYJACK knows that - he's just adjusting reality for his own convenience.  Recall for a second that Flyjack is also a self confessed particle physics expert who has commented at length about Tom's particle list etiology! It's all so very convenient.  :D

BS.. paper straps would be long gone...  the edges of the bills were completely missing, the outside bills more degraded that leaves only the in between.. perhaps Bruce can see the in between. That is only 4 bills that MIGHT have a trace..