Please reconsider R99. Don’t leave and don’t take down your posts. Decisions made while angry are not always the best ones. I like having you on the forum and think you’ve added a lot of value. Stick around. Don’t let nasty comments chase you off. It’s just noise. Look at signals. Ignore noise.

377

Flyjack wrote: “VHF...  and were there portable radios that had VHF and long wave? or low frequency?â€�

Yes. Nova Tech made one. It was also sold under the Bendix TM. It had a DF antenna but it didn’t work on VHF band. Could shoot bearings on LF beacon band and AM broadcast band. Bearings had 180 degree ambiguity due to no sense antenna circuitry.  A bit too big to easily conceal but might be hidden in a briefcase.

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377

I'm sorry to hear this R99...removing all of your important data will be a damaging point to this forum..I guess if it has come to this point perhaps I should also consider shutting the whole thing down..

I will take some time to consider my options..in the mean time everyone else can also give there input as to what they believe should be done or what they intend to do..perhaps it's similar to the DZ and it's ran it's course, I don't know...

Shutter

Here's the bottom line:

1) Posting on the site is a privilege, not a right.
2) No one is owed anything by virtue of this privilege other than to be treated with respect unconditionally.
3) If some are incapable of living up to the one requirement of treating others with differing opinions with respect then they should lose their privilege to contribute.

The forum should stay.

I concur, Shut.

Let 'em chill.

Quote

Your friend FLYJACK/BULLJAX has just dubbed Meyer, G, and R99 the 'THREE STOOGES" - He implies that he and Shutter are working together!

In fact he basically says he and Shutter are withholding evidence from the forum on purpose.

Guess I will have no interest whatever in your conference or whatever it is.

This is what I have to deal with lately..I've never held anything back on this forum. I showed the documents in question in hopes that it would help resolve the bickering, instead I'm accused of holding things back? I'm not working with Flyjack, I'm not conversing with him on PM's or emails etc. I didn't even see this post until now. I'm rather set back at this accusation. it's similar to the other accusations late last night against me..

Dave Brown

Well, well, well, isn't all of this interesting??....  You ban Georger for his retorts to this guy who just called the 3 of us the "3 stooges."  Why hasn't Masturbator Bloviator FlapHisWap been banned for his name-calling?  I disagree, Shutter, you cut this guy more slack than the two guys who have been here for years, who have done quality work and research for years --  who really do know what they're talking about.  You show the creator of confusion, the condescending bloviator more respect than you do R99 and Georger?  Really??  In all these years, I have never seen R99 get angry here, ever.  He's never used all caps in a whole paragraph before.  Now, he's gone.  I blame you, Shutter, for not taking control of the situation. 

Has it occurred to you that the reason R99 and Georger get so angry is because this FLY guy really doesn't know what he's really talking about, he's never done his homework but expects everyone else to do it for him?  Yet, you rarely ban this troll who goes on and on about the bundle's rubber bands, about why the cockpit did or didn't have a radio, about bands v. bundles v. packets v. whatever, and other happy horseshit. 

I disagree, you and FLY are in cahoots, you're buddies, you're in it together, you have let this troll ruin this forum, just like Quade let RMB run and ruin the DZ.

Do what you gotta do, Shutter....

Meyer

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Meyer, one can agree on several of these issue's. nothing can be a fact until all 4 corners are checked..

can anyone other than Flyjack respond to the document posted originally by Fly but is in this post..can this document be easily explained? it appears to be a valid point of discussion...

The use of the word 'band' is not clear here....it's not explained.  To me, it does not rule out rubber bands, or paper bands, for that matter.  Different bands from different banks seems to imply paper bands, but I think it's been stated that rubber bands were actually used.  Not clear from this document.  Randomized....that's clearly stated.

Meyer

The above quote can show how things can not be easily explained and grounds for discussion or further research. Carr states differently which could imply that they originally had paper bands on them and they were removed. it's also possible that the money was bundled with different amounts banned together..If T-bar wasn't involved this would not be relevant at all.

Conflicts
1) Tina stated "bank type bands"
2) Document stated that different bands from different banks could of been on the money.
3) Carr states the bank didn't want paper bands on the money showing where it came from...

I believe enough problems are involved to look into it further instead of washing it away and name calling...it's something like this that can be overlooked and turn out to very important to the case or possibly not but I believe it's worth trying to resolve...

This also doesn't imply I'm pals with someone..it implies that research is needed..something we use to do here when statements conflict!

I always thought that Cooper asked for the rear Airstairs down on takeoff..

Where is that actually shown?

The pilot transcripts contradict that..

Cooper asked for Tina to remain on the plane and lower the airstairs after takeoff, but the pilots wanted her off the plane and THEY later suggested that the plane takeoff with the rear airstairs open. TO GET ALL STEWS OFF THE PLANE. So, according to the transcript Cooper initially asked for Tina to lower the airstairs after takeoff then the pilots suggested to take off with airstairs down.

This would mean Cooper didn't request the airtairs down on take off.

--- transcript attached----

305 - wants to go to Mexico city
2 fly with gear down and flaps 15 degrees after underway all lights o be turned out
cannot land in US for fuel or other reason no crew member is to go aft of first class curtain

305 - Aft passenger loading door will be open and will remain open in that position and aft stairs to be lowered after takeoff

MSP FLIGHT OPS - The drag will be such that U cannot make Mexican border even with stairs up

305 will have to negotiate with him and will have to stop for fuel girls not off yet......

MSP FLIGHT OPS - The plane is operable with the aft stairs extended

MSP FLIGHT OPS - Just cannot make it with the flaps down guess can go only two to 2 and half hours...

305 Will talk to him again

305 Have negotiated release of 2 girls leaving any moment 3rd girl to stay with aircraft wants her to manipulate stairs for him after plane airborne  Have tried to tell him ..  operate stairs to lowered after takeoff  trying to get him to let us lower stairs partially for takeoff

MSP FLIGHT OPS - Don't know of anyway to lock stairs in intermediate position

305 will talk to him again

follow up..

Looking more into this, I found that Snowmman found the same conflict back on DZ.. Ckret replied but the issue was dropped.


Jun 20, 2008, 10:32 AM
Post #2868 of 58140 (64405 views)


snowmman - When I first read the transcripts, I thought it was very clear that Cooper didn't ask for the stairs down on takeoff, and that Flt Ops/crew got into the discussion because they didn't believe in deployment in the air.

I always thought that Cooper asked for the aft door open and stairs deployed in flight.

I went along with Ckret's insistence that Cooper asked for stairs deployed on takeoff, assuming there must be some other interviews that haven't been released.

Then I thought "What if people misremembered on their interviews...what if the transcripts (real time) are actually the best source of data for what Cooper actually asked for"

Ckret: can you reference the passage in the transcripts that tells you Cooper asked for stairs deployed on takeoff?

My thinking is based on page 11 of the transcripts


Ckret - It's not insisting, its me telling you what the crew said, I have no idea if they are right or worng, I can only tell you what they said and nothing in the investigation points to them lying about Cooper wanting the airstairs down for takeoff. They were all interviewed the night they got off the plane so I highly doubt their memory would have lapsed on such an issue

---

If you read the Crew interview "summaries" it does suggest that Cooper asked for rear airstairs down,, however, the transcripts are real time and more reliable than the FBI summaries..

Apparently the crew was together during the interviews, they should have been kept apart.. so they couldn't have influenced each other.


I believe, per real time transcripts that the crew initiated the take off with Airstairs down idea to get Tina off the plane with the other stews and there was some confusion by the FBI agents in interpreting the crew interview... perhaps Cooper's demand of "rear door open" was misunderstood by interviewer.

.

The crew had nothing to do with Cooper's demands other than convincing him that the stairs can not be extended or partially extended for takeoff...