Poll

Do you believe Cooper lived or died. the option are below to cast a vote...

0% Cooper lived
6 (9.4%)
25% Cooper lived
4 (6.3%)
35% Cooper lived.
2 (3.1%)
50% Cooper lived
14 (21.9%)
75% Cooper lived
14 (21.9%)
100 Cooper lived
24 (37.5%)

Total Members Voted: 59

Author Topic: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case  (Read 1835074 times)

georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #2430 on: December 07, 2017, 11:31:46 PM »
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I think it's safe to say most of us don't really care what happened behind the scenes during the Josh Gates program.

That includes me and probably Meyer as well. ;D


Absolutely, and I regret going into some of the gory behind-the-scenes details regarding my conflicts with "street savvy journalist" Bruce Smith.  He wanted to be "drama queen for a day" here on the forum and spill all for all to see.  I did not want to go there, and it was unnecessary, actually.  .  I apologize -- it's true, no one here is actually interested in all the bullshit that went on behind the scenes. 

In spite of it all, I value the experience.  It was good to see, and spend the day with, R99.  We went over lots of information, and had lengthy discussion,  the night before the shoot -- at the hotel.  I wanted to be sure I understood the Malay-Canby intersection and R99's theory and thinking on it. 

We did like 7-10 retakes on several scenes, sometimes more.  Josh Gates wanted what he wanted.  I too was disappointed the show took the turn it did with the Reno jump and Hall's theory -- we all know it just can't be.  That came out of nowhere!  I was shocked the program took that turn.  I was expecting to see Shutter's flight simulator and was disappointed that didn't happen. 

Meyer

Ive watched a lot of Gates programs since this ... Gates wants constant nonstop action and moves on if a segment bogs down. His programs are constantly resetting stages for the next boring 'nothing' which turns up nothing! Thats why I stopped watching his 'Action News Non News Action'.

My current LIKE is a series on the Zodiac Killer where they are trying to break his codes to identify other victims. They are using real (known) experts and some of the latest self learning computer technology. It turns out his code may be based in part on lunar calendar symbols the Navy incorporated into some of their coding systems! Bali Days. All of the known Zodiac murders seem to have occurred on 'Bali Days'. They now have a suspect who spent time in the Navy doing code work! ....... that is a light year away from Gates planet hopping in hip boots with a camera in his hand ...  :D
I have been watching Zodiac series. I find it very intersting. I watched the movie and they were saying that Arthur Leigh Allan was the killer but they couldn't prove it, and I find it interesting that the investigators are looking at a 2 other suspects. I hope they figure it out.

What interests me is the use of recursive modal logic to find symbolic associations that the designer devised. All of these codes could have been random nonsense. It is now appearing the writer was using actual codes he had designed. Then they found all of the known murders coincide with Bali Days! (a lunar calendar day). The symbol for that day had been used in several Navy codes. Had the Zodiac killer had Navy code training. Then it turned one of the suspects had! They are now using Bali Day dates to look for other unreported murders on the west and east coasts. They may have found two associations - one has lead to a site being excavated to look for a body, all based on the code break they think they have. Three cadaver dogs have signaled something is buried in the location the code lead them to...

Here's the link ... You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
« Last Edit: December 07, 2017, 11:43:54 PM by georger »
 
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MeyerLouie

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #2431 on: December 08, 2017, 02:56:50 AM »
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I think it's safe to say most of us don't really care what happened behind the scenes during the Josh Gates program.

That includes me and probably Meyer as well. ;D


Absolutely, and I regret going into some of the gory behind-the-scenes details regarding my conflicts with "street savvy journalist" Bruce Smith.  He wanted to be "drama queen for a day" here on the forum and spill all for all to see.  I did not want to go there, and it was unnecessary, actually.  .  I apologize -- it's true, no one here is actually interested in all the bullshit that went on behind the scenes. 

In spite of it all, I value the experience.  It was good to see, and spend the day with, R99.  We went over lots of information, and had lengthy discussion,  the night before the shoot -- at the hotel.  I wanted to be sure I understood the Malay-Canby intersection and R99's theory and thinking on it. 

We did like 7-10 retakes on several scenes, sometimes more.  Josh Gates wanted what he wanted.  I too was disappointed the show took the turn it did with the Reno jump and Hall's theory -- we all know it just can't be.  That came out of nowhere!  I was shocked the program took that turn.  I was expecting to see Shutter's flight simulator and was disappointed that didn't happen. 

Meyer

Ive watched a lot of Gates programs since this ... Gates wants constant nonstop action and moves on if a segment bogs down. His programs are constantly resetting stages for the next boring 'nothing' which turns up nothing! Thats why I stopped watching his 'Action News Non News Action'.

My current LIKE is a series on the Zodiac Killer where they are trying to break his codes to identify other victims. They are using real (known) experts and some of the latest self learning computer technology. It turns out his code may be based in part on lunar calendar symbols the Navy incorporated into some of their coding systems! Bali Days. All of the known Zodiac murders seem to have occurred on 'Bali Days'. They now have a suspect who spent time in the Navy doing code work! ....... that is a light year away from Gates planet hopping in hip boots with a camera in his hand ...  :D



Georger, I too have watched several TC/Expedition Unknown segments since the DBC program.  You are correct, Josh has non-stop energy, he knows what he wants, it's his program, he runs everything.  You will hear several times in his programs "Josh, did you find something?" or "Did Josh find something?"  It's all for the camera, it's all staged, it's for the central character, Josh Gates.  He's a star, no doubt about it.  I had no problem with that.  I found Josh Gates to be very kind, courteous, humble, and down-to-earth.  He's a great guy, he's very personable and he has a great sense of humor -- what you see is what you get.  In addition, he was very patient as he coached us on how to be in front of the camera.

He gets all excited about what he may find, but the elusive find just seems to always slip his grasp.  Just when you think he's got something, it slips away.... Maybe that's what keeps people coming back, they're hoping some day he will actually find the mystical, hidden treasure.

I too have taken interest in the Zodiac killer program you mention, Georger.  I watch it as often as I'm able.  I have a friend from Omak, WA who tells me he was one of the key investigators on the Zodiac killer case.   He's all retired now from law enforcement, he's in his late 70s.  He tells me they had a guy in their sights almost from the git-go.  They felt strongly that he was the Zodiac killer, but the actual proof and DNA match up just weren't there.  Maybe some progress on the case will be made with the code deciphering.

Meyer
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #2432 on: December 12, 2017, 06:12:40 PM »
Citizen Sleuths video - 4th installment of the DB Cooper and the FBI series

I had a lengthy phone interview with Tom Kaye a few weeks ago, and coupled with my notes and interviews over the years, here is my take on the Citizen Sleuths.

The video is up at YouTube:

« Last Edit: December 12, 2017, 06:13:11 PM by Bruce A. Smith »
 

georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #2433 on: December 13, 2017, 12:38:49 AM »
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Citizen Sleuths video - 4th installment of the DB Cooper and the FBI series

I had a lengthy phone interview with Tom Kaye a few weeks ago, and coupled with my notes and interviews over the years, here is my take on the Citizen Sleuths.

The video is up at YouTube:



Not bad. Very entertaining.  ;D
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #2434 on: December 13, 2017, 02:10:17 AM »
Thank you, G.
 

Offline DavidV

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #2435 on: December 13, 2017, 08:29:17 AM »
All,

Been looking over the handwritten notes taken by the crew during the hijacking. One thing I can't find is who wrote them?
The WSHS curator notes believes it was one person. From reading them my guess is Anderson.
Has anyone found out a different conclusion?

Thanks.
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #2436 on: December 13, 2017, 11:36:38 AM »
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All,

Been looking over the handwritten notes taken by the crew during the hijacking. One thing I can't find is who wrote them?
The WSHS curator notes believes it was one person. From reading them my guess is Anderson.
Has anyone found out a different conclusion?

Thanks.

Florence Schaffner took down the notes....

Quote
The captain instructed her to remain seated in the cockpit of the plane. Schaffner said that she began taking notes concerning the events that transpired during the remainder of the flight.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2017, 11:37:35 AM by Shutter »
 
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Offline Kermit

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #2437 on: December 13, 2017, 12:46:14 PM »
Looking at the survey, one thing appears clear. A lot of posters don’t buy into the theory that Cooper died in a no pull into the Columbia river. So if a majority think perhaps he survived, how did it happen ? Since it’s possible he made the jump and lived, is it wrong to pursue that avenue ?
Meyer and I met twice and pursued that possibility. I think we came up with a number of very real scenarios. Until I see some evidence that proves he’s dead, I will keep all possibilities open.
 

Offline 377

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #2438 on: December 13, 2017, 01:01:59 PM »
It was a very survivable jump IF you deployed the canopy and didn't land in water. If DBC landed in water it is possible that his body would never be found. If he cratered on dry land, I think his remains would have been discovered by now. The cadmium plated steel (and some stainless steel) harness hardware would survive intact for many many decades. I think hunters and hikers would have covered most of the credible LZ areas given enough time.

The FBI was publically promoting a certain death scenario for a night jet jump but behind the scenes, they were taking investigative steps that indicated they believed it was a survivable jump carried out by an experienced parachutist. They were looking for a skilled jumper. The FBI pulled all the USPA skydiver membership data and went to at least one US Army Airborne base to interview possible suspects.   

A jet jump by itself is no big deal. I have jumped from from a DC-9 airstair opening and hundreds of other jumpers have jumped from 727s. It was the environment and conditions surrounding the NORJACK jump that generated most of the risk.

377
 

Offline DavidV

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #2439 on: December 13, 2017, 01:21:12 PM »
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All,

Been looking over the handwritten notes taken by the crew during the hijacking. One thing I can't find is who wrote them?
The WSHS curator notes believes it was one person. From reading them my guess is Anderson.
Has anyone found out a different conclusion?

Thanks.

Florence Schaffner took down the notes....

Quote
The captain instructed her to remain seated in the cockpit of the plane. Schaffner said that she began taking notes concerning the events that transpired during the remainder of the flight.

Thank you Shutter. Must have missed that in all the FBI docs.
 

FLYJACK

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #2440 on: December 13, 2017, 02:12:49 PM »
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Citizen Sleuths video - 4th installment of the DB Cooper and the FBI series

I had a lengthy phone interview with Tom Kaye a few weeks ago, and coupled with my notes and interviews over the years, here is my take on the Citizen Sleuths.

The video is up at YouTube:


Nice work Bruce,, :bravo:

A few comments..

I traced the two labels on the Cooper tie and they only existed SIMULTANEOUSLY on ties made around 1965, that makes the tie about 5 years old at the time of the hijacking. Previous guess was 1-2 years old based on a Penny's employee assumption.

That Placard was not from the main Airstair control (lever) but from the much smaller secondary emergency release door which detaches completely.

The 727 did have titanium parts for the water system in and around the rear and lav and Cooper may have contaminated the tie with existing particles using it to wipe his prints.

Lycopodium spores have been used in fingerprint powder..
 
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georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #2441 on: December 13, 2017, 02:25:30 PM »
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Citizen Sleuths video - 4th installment of the DB Cooper and the FBI series

I had a lengthy phone interview with Tom Kaye a few weeks ago, and coupled with my notes and interviews over the years, here is my take on the Citizen Sleuths.

The video is up at YouTube:


Nice work Bruce,, :bravo:

A few comments..

I traced the two labels on the Cooper tie and they only existed SIMULTANEOUSLY on ties made around 1965, that makes the tie about 5 years old at the time of the hijacking. Previous guess was 1-2 years old based on a Penny's employee assumption.

That Placard was not from the main Airstair control (lever) but from the much smaller secondary emergency release door which detaches completely.

The 727 did have titanium parts for the water system in and around the rear and lav and Cooper may have contaminated the tie with existing particles using it to wipe his prints.

Lycopodium spores have been used in fingerprint powder..

Thats interesting if true -
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #2442 on: December 13, 2017, 02:55:19 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
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Citizen Sleuths video - 4th installment of the DB Cooper and the FBI series

I had a lengthy phone interview with Tom Kaye a few weeks ago, and coupled with my notes and interviews over the years, here is my take on the Citizen Sleuths.

The video is up at YouTube:


Nice work Bruce,, :bravo:

A few comments..

I traced the two labels on the Cooper tie and they only existed SIMULTANEOUSLY on ties made around 1965, that makes the tie about 5 years old at the time of the hijacking. Previous guess was 1-2 years old based on a Penny's employee assumption.

That Placard was not from the main Airstair control (lever) but from the much smaller secondary emergency release door which detaches completely.

The 727 did have titanium parts for the water system in and around the rear and lav and Cooper may have contaminated the tie with existing particles using it to wipe his prints.

Lycopodium spores have been used in fingerprint powder..


I'll add those bits to my notes, Flying J. Thank you.

You should make your own DB Cooper videos!
 

FLYJACK

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #2443 on: December 13, 2017, 07:58:24 PM »
Locally, Oregon Metallurgical produced Titanium sponge in the late 1960's (during the life of Cooper's tie) and they cut 200 employees in 1971. Could one of those be Cooper??

"With a recession beginning, the market for titanium virtually disappeared the following year when Congress cut off funds to the Boeing Company, which was developing a U.S. version of the supersonic transport (SST), which was to have been a nearly all-titanium aircraft. Oremet was forced to mothball its new sponge plant. It also suspended research and development programs and cut its workforce by two-thirds, from more than 300 to barely more than 100 employees. Sales in 1971 fell to $8.3 million and Oremet posted its first loss, of nearly $2 million, in more than a decade."

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« Last Edit: December 13, 2017, 08:04:53 PM by FLYJACK »
 

MeyerLouie

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #2444 on: December 13, 2017, 08:17:54 PM »
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Citizen Sleuths video - 4th installment of the DB Cooper and the FBI series

I had a lengthy phone interview with Tom Kaye a few weeks ago, and coupled with my notes and interviews over the years, here is my take on the Citizen Sleuths.

The video is up at YouTube:



Not bad. Very entertaining.  ;D



If you would have put out videos like this right before or right after your book came out, you might have gotten more sales.  I'm still amazed you did not hit up Josh Gates to give you two sentences to plug your book on the EU program.  Lost opportunity, gone forever.   I am almost afraid to watch your video, how much will be actual fact, how much will be Bruce Smith's "savvy journalist" opinions?

Meyer