Poll

Do you believe Cooper lived or died. the option are below to cast a vote...

0% Cooper lived
6 (9.4%)
25% Cooper lived
4 (6.3%)
35% Cooper lived.
2 (3.1%)
50% Cooper lived
14 (21.9%)
75% Cooper lived
14 (21.9%)
100 Cooper lived
24 (37.5%)

Total Members Voted: 59

Author Topic: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case  (Read 1832351 times)

georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1845 on: May 14, 2017, 01:08:19 AM »
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Yes, it's north of Merwin, how far, I don't recall at the moment.

What needs to be pointed out is the fact of the simulation can give a best estimate only. I can't reproduce every single thing they did in the flight. it's impossible. I went by the given time frames, altitudes, and speeds. I also put winds aloft into play. I was able to match the speeds, including ground speeds. I believe I still have some of the simulations saved. the sim has a black box that can tell me things needed., in the replay I can also stop at any given point for any reason...

The way I analyzed this the time wasn't used but location was based on placard. Time = events not location.

Getting the most northern possible location for 20:09.. can bring the two together. There may be an intersecting point. I suspect north of Merwin..

Time is measured in hours, minutes, and seconds - not in events in the world!

Time hasn't been measured by worldly events since the calendar clocks of the Hittites, Maya, or the quatrains of Nostradamus etc.   

Clocks are independent devices that are coordinated by some mechanical or electronic means across distance, using some arbitrary standard like the orbit of the Moon, Sun, stars, standard freq of an atom, etc.

Clocks are independent of worldly events. That is their value.

Some of the clocks that were active in the Cooper case were:

ATC network clocks
NWO communications network clocks
USAF clocks
Intercept planes and their clocks
Clocks aboard flight 305
Radar network clocks (system calibration timing)
Airport clocks
Flight data recorder clock
etc

The opening pages to the NWA FBI Search mentions "time correlation from the above USAF radar information and from the NWA communications network tape recording ....."
Other clocks, timing cross checks and calibration may have been considered and used, and probably were unavoidable as a concomitant part of the analysis process.

   





« Last Edit: May 14, 2017, 04:42:28 AM by georger »
 

FLYJACK

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1846 on: May 14, 2017, 08:46:01 AM »
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Yes, it's north of Merwin, how far, I don't recall at the moment.

What needs to be pointed out is the fact of the simulation can give a best estimate only. I can't reproduce every single thing they did in the flight. it's impossible. I went by the given time frames, altitudes, and speeds. I also put winds aloft into play. I was able to match the speeds, including ground speeds. I believe I still have some of the simulations saved. the sim has a black box that can tell me things needed., in the replay I can also stop at any given point for any reason...

The way I analyzed this the time wasn't used but location was based on placard. Time = events not location.

Getting the most northern possible location for 20:09.. can bring the two together. There may be an intersecting point. I suspect north of Merwin..

Time is measured in hours, minutes, and seconds - not in events in the world!

Time hasn't been measured by worldly events since the calendar clocks of the Hittites, Maya, or the quatrains of Nostradamus etc.   

Clocks are independent devices that are coordinated by some mechanical or electronic means across distance, using some arbitrary standard like the orbit of the Moon, Sun, stars, standard freq of an atom, etc.

Clocks are independent of worldly events. That is their value.

Some of the clocks that were active in the Cooper case were:

ATC network clocks
NWO communications network clocks
USAF clocks
Intercept planes and their clocks
Clocks aboard flight 305
Radar network clocks (system calibration timing)
Airport clocks
Flight data recorder clock
etc

The opening pages to the NWA FBI Search mentions "time correlation from the above USAF radar information and from the NWA communications network tape recording ....."
Other clocks, timing cross checks and calibration may have been considered and used, and probably were unavoidable as a concomitant part of the analysis process.

 

Georger,

If you have all these timestamps..

What was the precise location of the plane when DBC jumped?
 

Robert99

  • Guest
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1847 on: May 14, 2017, 02:03:43 PM »
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Yes, it's north of Merwin, how far, I don't recall at the moment.

What needs to be pointed out is the fact of the simulation can give a best estimate only. I can't reproduce every single thing they did in the flight. it's impossible. I went by the given time frames, altitudes, and speeds. I also put winds aloft into play. I was able to match the speeds, including ground speeds. I believe I still have some of the simulations saved. the sim has a black box that can tell me things needed., in the replay I can also stop at any given point for any reason...

The way I analyzed this the time wasn't used but location was based on placard. Time = events not location.

Getting the most northern possible location for 20:09.. can bring the two together. There may be an intersecting point. I suspect north of Merwin..

Time is measured in hours, minutes, and seconds - not in events in the world!

Time hasn't been measured by worldly events since the calendar clocks of the Hittites, Maya, or the quatrains of Nostradamus etc.   

Clocks are independent devices that are coordinated by some mechanical or electronic means across distance, using some arbitrary standard like the orbit of the Moon, Sun, stars, standard freq of an atom, etc.

Clocks are independent of worldly events. That is their value.

Some of the clocks that were active in the Cooper case were:

ATC network clocks
NWO communications network clocks
USAF clocks
Intercept planes and their clocks
Clocks aboard flight 305
Radar network clocks (system calibration timing)
Airport clocks
Flight data recorder clock
etc

The opening pages to the NWA FBI Search mentions "time correlation from the above USAF radar information and from the NWA communications network tape recording ....."
Other clocks, timing cross checks and calibration may have been considered and used, and probably were unavoidable as a concomitant part of the analysis process.

 

Georger,

If you have all these timestamps..

What was the precise location of the plane when DBC jumped?

FLYJACK,

The problems resulting from the FBI redacting the Seattle ATC transcript for the flight south from Seattle has been discussed at length both here and on DropZone.

You obviously haven't studied the transcripts or any other evidence that supports an actual flight path for the airliner.
 

FLYJACK

  • Guest
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1848 on: May 14, 2017, 02:15:13 PM »
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Yes, it's north of Merwin, how far, I don't recall at the moment.

What needs to be pointed out is the fact of the simulation can give a best estimate only. I can't reproduce every single thing they did in the flight. it's impossible. I went by the given time frames, altitudes, and speeds. I also put winds aloft into play. I was able to match the speeds, including ground speeds. I believe I still have some of the simulations saved. the sim has a black box that can tell me things needed., in the replay I can also stop at any given point for any reason...

The way I analyzed this the time wasn't used but location was based on placard. Time = events not location.

Getting the most northern possible location for 20:09.. can bring the two together. There may be an intersecting point. I suspect north of Merwin..

Time is measured in hours, minutes, and seconds - not in events in the world!

Time hasn't been measured by worldly events since the calendar clocks of the Hittites, Maya, or the quatrains of Nostradamus etc.   

Clocks are independent devices that are coordinated by some mechanical or electronic means across distance, using some arbitrary standard like the orbit of the Moon, Sun, stars, standard freq of an atom, etc.

Clocks are independent of worldly events. That is their value.

Some of the clocks that were active in the Cooper case were:

ATC network clocks
NWO communications network clocks
USAF clocks
Intercept planes and their clocks
Clocks aboard flight 305
Radar network clocks (system calibration timing)
Airport clocks
Flight data recorder clock
etc

The opening pages to the NWA FBI Search mentions "time correlation from the above USAF radar information and from the NWA communications network tape recording ....."
Other clocks, timing cross checks and calibration may have been considered and used, and probably were unavoidable as a concomitant part of the analysis process.

 

Georger,

If you have all these timestamps..

What was the precise location of the plane when DBC jumped?

FLYJACK,

The problems resulting from the FBI redacting the Seattle ATC transcript for the flight south from Seattle has been discussed at length both here and on DropZone.

You obviously haven't studied the transcripts or any other evidence that supports an actual flight path for the airliner.

Not my point,

Timestamps don't tell you the exact location of the plane when DBC left..

 

Robert99

  • Guest
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1849 on: May 14, 2017, 02:22:40 PM »
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Yes, it's north of Merwin, how far, I don't recall at the moment.

What needs to be pointed out is the fact of the simulation can give a best estimate only. I can't reproduce every single thing they did in the flight. it's impossible. I went by the given time frames, altitudes, and speeds. I also put winds aloft into play. I was able to match the speeds, including ground speeds. I believe I still have some of the simulations saved. the sim has a black box that can tell me things needed., in the replay I can also stop at any given point for any reason...

The way I analyzed this the time wasn't used but location was based on placard. Time = events not location.

Getting the most northern possible location for 20:09.. can bring the two together. There may be an intersecting point. I suspect north of Merwin..

Time is measured in hours, minutes, and seconds - not in events in the world!

Time hasn't been measured by worldly events since the calendar clocks of the Hittites, Maya, or the quatrains of Nostradamus etc.   

Clocks are independent devices that are coordinated by some mechanical or electronic means across distance, using some arbitrary standard like the orbit of the Moon, Sun, stars, standard freq of an atom, etc.

Clocks are independent of worldly events. That is their value.

Some of the clocks that were active in the Cooper case were:

ATC network clocks
NWO communications network clocks
USAF clocks
Intercept planes and their clocks
Clocks aboard flight 305
Radar network clocks (system calibration timing)
Airport clocks
Flight data recorder clock
etc

The opening pages to the NWA FBI Search mentions "time correlation from the above USAF radar information and from the NWA communications network tape recording ....."
Other clocks, timing cross checks and calibration may have been considered and used, and probably were unavoidable as a concomitant part of the analysis process.

 

Georger,

If you have all these timestamps..

What was the precise location of the plane when DBC jumped?

FLYJACK,

The problems resulting from the FBI redacting the Seattle ATC transcript for the flight south from Seattle has been discussed at length both here and on DropZone.

You obviously haven't studied the transcripts or any other evidence that supports an actual flight path for the airliner.

Not my point,

Timestamps don't tell you the exact location of the plane when DBC left..

FLYJACK,

To determine the exact location of the plane when Cooper jumped, you must determine the flight path of the airliner plus the time of the jump.

As pointed out above, the possibility of determining the flight path with near 100 percent accuracy has been reduced by the FBI redacting the Seattle ATC radio transcripts.  Nevertheless, the probable flight path can be estimated from statements made by the flight crew, statements made by FBI agents, and other sources.

None of the above supports your efforts.
 

georger

  • Guest
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1850 on: May 14, 2017, 02:30:38 PM »
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Yes, it's north of Merwin, how far, I don't recall at the moment.

What needs to be pointed out is the fact of the simulation can give a best estimate only. I can't reproduce every single thing they did in the flight. it's impossible. I went by the given time frames, altitudes, and speeds. I also put winds aloft into play. I was able to match the speeds, including ground speeds. I believe I still have some of the simulations saved. the sim has a black box that can tell me things needed., in the replay I can also stop at any given point for any reason...

The way I analyzed this the time wasn't used but location was based on placard. Time = events not location.

Getting the most northern possible location for 20:09.. can bring the two together. There may be an intersecting point. I suspect north of Merwin..

Time is measured in hours, minutes, and seconds - not in events in the world!

Time hasn't been measured by worldly events since the calendar clocks of the Hittites, Maya, or the quatrains of Nostradamus etc.   

Clocks are independent devices that are coordinated by some mechanical or electronic means across distance, using some arbitrary standard like the orbit of the Moon, Sun, stars, standard freq of an atom, etc.

Clocks are independent of worldly events. That is their value.

Some of the clocks that were active in the Cooper case were:

ATC network clocks
NWO communications network clocks
USAF clocks
Intercept planes and their clocks
Clocks aboard flight 305
Radar network clocks (system calibration timing)
Airport clocks
Flight data recorder clock
etc

The opening pages to the NWA FBI Search mentions "time correlation from the above USAF radar information and from the NWA communications network tape recording ....."
Other clocks, timing cross checks and calibration may have been considered and used, and probably were unavoidable as a concomitant part of the analysis process.

 

Georger,

If you have all these timestamps..

What was the precise location of the plane when DBC jumped?

FLYJACK,

The problems resulting from the FBI redacting the Seattle ATC transcript for the flight south from Seattle has been discussed at length both here and on DropZone.

You obviously haven't studied the transcripts or any other evidence that supports an actual flight path for the airliner.

Not my point,

Timestamps don't tell you the exact location of the plane when DBC left..

FLYJACK,

To determine the exact location of the plane when Cooper jumped, you must determine the flight path of the airliner plus the time of the jump.

As pointed out above, the possibility of determining the flight path with near 100 percent accuracy has been reduced by the FBI redacting the Seattle ATC radio transcripts.  Nevertheless, the probable flight path can be estimated from statements made by the flight crew, statements made by FBI agents, and other sources.

None of the above supports your efforts.

He is justifying numerology and leading us there.
 

FLYJACK

  • Guest
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1851 on: May 14, 2017, 02:40:37 PM »
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Yes, it's north of Merwin, how far, I don't recall at the moment.

What needs to be pointed out is the fact of the simulation can give a best estimate only. I can't reproduce every single thing they did in the flight. it's impossible. I went by the given time frames, altitudes, and speeds. I also put winds aloft into play. I was able to match the speeds, including ground speeds. I believe I still have some of the simulations saved. the sim has a black box that can tell me things needed., in the replay I can also stop at any given point for any reason...

The way I analyzed this the time wasn't used but location was based on placard. Time = events not location.

Getting the most northern possible location for 20:09.. can bring the two together. There may be an intersecting point. I suspect north of Merwin..

Time is measured in hours, minutes, and seconds - not in events in the world!

Time hasn't been measured by worldly events since the calendar clocks of the Hittites, Maya, or the quatrains of Nostradamus etc.   

Clocks are independent devices that are coordinated by some mechanical or electronic means across distance, using some arbitrary standard like the orbit of the Moon, Sun, stars, standard freq of an atom, etc.

Clocks are independent of worldly events. That is their value.

Some of the clocks that were active in the Cooper case were:

ATC network clocks
NWO communications network clocks
USAF clocks
Intercept planes and their clocks
Clocks aboard flight 305
Radar network clocks (system calibration timing)
Airport clocks
Flight data recorder clock
etc

The opening pages to the NWA FBI Search mentions "time correlation from the above USAF radar information and from the NWA communications network tape recording ....."
Other clocks, timing cross checks and calibration may have been considered and used, and probably were unavoidable as a concomitant part of the analysis process.

 

Georger,

If you have all these timestamps..

What was the precise location of the plane when DBC jumped?

FLYJACK,

The problems resulting from the FBI redacting the Seattle ATC transcript for the flight south from Seattle has been discussed at length both here and on DropZone.

You obviously haven't studied the transcripts or any other evidence that supports an actual flight path for the airliner.

Not my point,

Timestamps don't tell you the exact location of the plane when DBC left..

FLYJACK,

To determine the exact location of the plane when Cooper jumped, you must determine the flight path of the airliner plus the time of the jump.

As pointed out above, the possibility of determining the flight path with near 100 percent accuracy has been reduced by the FBI redacting the Seattle ATC radio transcripts.  Nevertheless, the probable flight path can be estimated from statements made by the flight crew, statements made by FBI agents, and other sources.

None of the above supports your efforts.

He is justifying numerology and leading us there.

Do the timestamps support a precise plane location for the DBC jump?

Do they support a geographic approximation? If so what is that?
 

georger

  • Guest
Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1852 on: May 14, 2017, 03:13:49 PM »
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Yes, it's north of Merwin, how far, I don't recall at the moment.

What needs to be pointed out is the fact of the simulation can give a best estimate only. I can't reproduce every single thing they did in the flight. it's impossible. I went by the given time frames, altitudes, and speeds. I also put winds aloft into play. I was able to match the speeds, including ground speeds. I believe I still have some of the simulations saved. the sim has a black box that can tell me things needed., in the replay I can also stop at any given point for any reason...

The way I analyzed this the time wasn't used but location was based on placard. Time = events not location.

Getting the most northern possible location for 20:09.. can bring the two together. There may be an intersecting point. I suspect north of Merwin..

Time is measured in hours, minutes, and seconds - not in events in the world!

Time hasn't been measured by worldly events since the calendar clocks of the Hittites, Maya, or the quatrains of Nostradamus etc.   

Clocks are independent devices that are coordinated by some mechanical or electronic means across distance, using some arbitrary standard like the orbit of the Moon, Sun, stars, standard freq of an atom, etc.

Clocks are independent of worldly events. That is their value.

Some of the clocks that were active in the Cooper case were:

ATC network clocks
NWO communications network clocks
USAF clocks
Intercept planes and their clocks
Clocks aboard flight 305
Radar network clocks (system calibration timing)
Airport clocks
Flight data recorder clock
etc

The opening pages to the NWA FBI Search mentions "time correlation from the above USAF radar information and from the NWA communications network tape recording ....."
Other clocks, timing cross checks and calibration may have been considered and used, and probably were unavoidable as a concomitant part of the analysis process.

 

Georger,

If you have all these timestamps..

What was the precise location of the plane when DBC jumped?

FLYJACK,

The problems resulting from the FBI redacting the Seattle ATC transcript for the flight south from Seattle has been discussed at length both here and on DropZone.

You obviously haven't studied the transcripts or any other evidence that supports an actual flight path for the airliner.

Not my point,

Timestamps don't tell you the exact location of the plane when DBC left..

FLYJACK,

To determine the exact location of the plane when Cooper jumped, you must determine the flight path of the airliner plus the time of the jump.

As pointed out above, the possibility of determining the flight path with near 100 percent accuracy has been reduced by the FBI redacting the Seattle ATC radio transcripts.  Nevertheless, the probable flight path can be estimated from statements made by the flight crew, statements made by FBI agents, and other sources.

None of the above supports your efforts.

He is justifying numerology and leading us there.

Do the timestamps support a precise plane location for the DBC jump?

Do they support a geographic approximation? If so what is that?

Time is time.  Location is position. This is not space-time in which you need gravitation. This is Newtonian mechanics, not Chaldean geometry controled by the gods' relation to Prince Kajahayayahtaah or by your best guess as to Cooper's intentions and psychology.

We went through this shit clear back in 2007 when Carr announced that according to his 'experience' as an FBI Agent he was sure 'Cooper INTENDED to bail near Seattle, based on Cooper's actions putting a parachute on early'.

And your 'recipe' for Cooper's intention is no better or worse than anyone else's and probably worse since you have a candidate to sell and a book to write.

We know a lot because we've seen a lot and had to settle claims like this before.  >:D
 
In other words: this is a mathematical problem [Time is time.  Location is position.] where only physical events and measurements play a role, not psychology of best-guessing. That is precisely the problem the NWA engineers and USAF Analysis Group faced. Their best numerical guess is represented by the NWA FBI Search map we all know which was based on actual physical events in real time. You must present some brand new 'physical events' that happened which nobody knows about and only then can an intelligent discussion proceed.

People have already looked for physical evidence in-and-around the placard site and found nothing. The Hick's find generated a lot of interest and searches in that whole area. I am 100% sure Kermit can document all of that when and if he were to decide to do that.

What we need are the actual radar tapes, the full unredacted ATC recordings, or ANYTHING of an evidentiary nature that will shed light on what is an empiracle problem, not some problem in psychology and guessing. There it is in black and white.     
 
« Last Edit: May 14, 2017, 03:38:25 PM by georger »
 

FLYJACK

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1853 on: May 14, 2017, 03:39:06 PM »
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Yes, it's north of Merwin, how far, I don't recall at the moment.

What needs to be pointed out is the fact of the simulation can give a best estimate only. I can't reproduce every single thing they did in the flight. it's impossible. I went by the given time frames, altitudes, and speeds. I also put winds aloft into play. I was able to match the speeds, including ground speeds. I believe I still have some of the simulations saved. the sim has a black box that can tell me things needed., in the replay I can also stop at any given point for any reason...

The way I analyzed this the time wasn't used but location was based on placard. Time = events not location.

Getting the most northern possible location for 20:09.. can bring the two together. There may be an intersecting point. I suspect north of Merwin..

Time is measured in hours, minutes, and seconds - not in events in the world!

Time hasn't been measured by worldly events since the calendar clocks of the Hittites, Maya, or the quatrains of Nostradamus etc.   

Clocks are independent devices that are coordinated by some mechanical or electronic means across distance, using some arbitrary standard like the orbit of the Moon, Sun, stars, standard freq of an atom, etc.

Clocks are independent of worldly events. That is their value.

Some of the clocks that were active in the Cooper case were:

ATC network clocks
NWO communications network clocks
USAF clocks
Intercept planes and their clocks
Clocks aboard flight 305
Radar network clocks (system calibration timing)
Airport clocks
Flight data recorder clock
etc

The opening pages to the NWA FBI Search mentions "time correlation from the above USAF radar information and from the NWA communications network tape recording ....."
Other clocks, timing cross checks and calibration may have been considered and used, and probably were unavoidable as a concomitant part of the analysis process.

 

Georger,

If you have all these timestamps..

What was the precise location of the plane when DBC jumped?

FLYJACK,

The problems resulting from the FBI redacting the Seattle ATC transcript for the flight south from Seattle has been discussed at length both here and on DropZone.

You obviously haven't studied the transcripts or any other evidence that supports an actual flight path for the airliner.

Not my point,

Timestamps don't tell you the exact location of the plane when DBC left..

FLYJACK,

To determine the exact location of the plane when Cooper jumped, you must determine the flight path of the airliner plus the time of the jump.

As pointed out above, the possibility of determining the flight path with near 100 percent accuracy has been reduced by the FBI redacting the Seattle ATC radio transcripts.  Nevertheless, the probable flight path can be estimated from statements made by the flight crew, statements made by FBI agents, and other sources.

None of the above supports your efforts.

He is justifying numerology and leading us there.

Do the timestamps support a precise plane location for the DBC jump?

Do they support a geographic approximation? If so what is that?

Time is time.  Location is position. This is not space-time in which you need gravitation. This is Newtonian mechanics, not Chaldean geometry controled by the gods' relation to Prince Kajahayayahtaah or by your best guess as to Cooper's intentions and psychology.

We went through this shit clear back in 2007 when Carr announced that according to his 'experience' as an FBI Agent he was sure 'Cooper INTENDED to bail near Seattle, based on Cooper's actions putting a parachute on early'.

And your 'recipe' for Cooper's intention is no better or worse than anyone else's and probably worse since you have a candidate to sell and a book to write.

We know a lot because we've seen a lot and had to settle claims like this before.  >:D
 

 

sure, but I'll note you still refuse to answer my question..

with all your timestamps, where was the plane when DBC left it?
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1854 on: May 14, 2017, 03:41:40 PM »
Quote
with all your timestamps, where was the plane when DBC left it?

Not where you think...
 

FLYJACK

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1855 on: May 14, 2017, 03:47:43 PM »
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Quote
with all your timestamps, where was the plane when DBC left it?

Not where you think...

Nonsense, you guys don't even understand what I said.

I said START 1-2 miles south of the Placard and WORK south <<< that is in the zone.

The further you go south the lower the probability.
 

georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1856 on: May 14, 2017, 03:48:20 PM »
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Quote
with all your timestamps, where was the plane when DBC left it?

Not where you think...

He just cant come to grips with the fact this is an *empirical* problem. In need of actual physical evidence.
 

georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1857 on: May 14, 2017, 03:49:38 PM »
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Quote
with all your timestamps, where was the plane when DBC left it?

Not where you think...

Nonsense, you guys don't even understand what I said.

I said START 1-2 miles south of the Placard and WORK south <<< that is in the zone.

The further you go south the lower the probability.

we understand this very well.

how was lunch today? Are they serving meatloaf? 
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1858 on: May 14, 2017, 03:52:13 PM »
Ok, so the money found in 1980 wasn't DBC cash, Cooper jumped before the 8:10 oscillation. the money was now hung up somewhere in the silver lake vicinity (on the stairs due to torn panels) and was released over the Columbia river waiting to be dredged up..?

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On a one to ten scale we value the transcript info at 10 and current day testimony from people a 1.
 

FLYJACK

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1859 on: May 14, 2017, 03:55:41 PM »
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Ok, so the money found in 1980 wasn't DBC cash, Cooper jumped before the 8:10 oscillation. the money was now hung up somewhere in the silver lake vicinity (on the stairs due to torn panels) and was released over the Columbia river waiting to be dredged up..?

Quote
On a one to ten scale we value the transcript info at 10 and current day testimony from people a 1.

I'll try again, somebody tell me exactly where the plane was when DBC left it?

Use your timestamps, transcripts or whatever you need.