Poll

Do you believe Cooper lived or died. the option are below to cast a vote...

0% Cooper lived
6 (9.4%)
25% Cooper lived
4 (6.3%)
35% Cooper lived.
2 (3.1%)
50% Cooper lived
14 (21.9%)
75% Cooper lived
14 (21.9%)
100 Cooper lived
24 (37.5%)

Total Members Voted: 59

Author Topic: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case  (Read 1832060 times)

Offline Shutter

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1635 on: April 29, 2017, 10:36:34 AM »
It's not easy to maintain hundreds of thousands of documents and pieces of evidence. the documents from the OK corral went missing once they were moved..

Quote
A missing handwritten transcript from a coroner's inquest held after the legendary gunfight at the OK Corral has resurfaced in a dusty box more than 125 years after the most famous shootout in the history of the Wild West.

The document, which had been missing since it was photocopied in the 1960s, was found when court clerks stumbled on the box while reorganising files in an old jail storage room in Bisbee, south of Tombstone, the Arizona frontier town where the gunbattle took place.

This took approx. 50 years to surface. imagine if we were investigating this part of history. I'm sure we would of heard stories of how they "conveniently lost them" or probably destroyed them to cover up the truth.

It sounds like they were taken from the original storage spot where they were safe and not put back properly and were lost or forgotten....
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1636 on: April 29, 2017, 04:25:22 PM »
Dummy Chute, Revisited

A new DBC reader by the name of John S. has queried me several times on a interesting angle of Norjak: Why wasn't the dummy chute found on the plane in Reno? If it couldn't be attached to the Pioneer harness and wasn't used to stash money, what value did it have? If Cooper didn't simply leave it on the plane as useless junk, then what did he do with it? What are some of the plausible uses?

Plus, was the second reserve chute really a dummy parachute with an "X" on it? What do we really know about this parachute?
 

georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1637 on: April 29, 2017, 04:40:06 PM »
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Dummy Chute, Revisited

A new DBC reader by the name of John S. has queried me several times on a interesting angle of Norjak: Why wasn't the dummy chute found on the plane in Reno? If it couldn't be attached to the Pioneer harness and wasn't used to stash money, what value did it have? If Cooper didn't simply leave it on the plane as useless junk, then what did he do with it? What are some of the plausible uses?

Plus, was the second reserve chute really a dummy parachute with an "X" on it? What do we really know about this parachute?

Obviously the FBI and Cossey were lying through their teeth.

The dummy chute idea was invented for dummies.

The socalled dummy chute was a backpack which Cooper wanted! Cooper took the backpack with him, which makes Tina's stories a lie too.

What else can be imagined that might be true?  Your work is impeccable Bruce. 
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1638 on: April 29, 2017, 06:50:33 PM »
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Dummy Chute, Revisited

A new DBC reader by the name of John S. has queried me several times on a interesting angle of Norjak: Why wasn't the dummy chute found on the plane in Reno? If it couldn't be attached to the Pioneer harness and wasn't used to stash money, what value did it have? If Cooper didn't simply leave it on the plane as useless junk, then what did he do with it? What are some of the plausible uses?

Plus, was the second reserve chute really a dummy parachute with an "X" on it? What do we really know about this parachute?

I think we have addressed this one as much as the others...no, it doesn't make sense that he left one chute that was not needed, but he had nowhere to attach another back chute. the front chute? a stretch could say he used some of the chute cord to attach the chute, or he tossed it..if he didn't need it, why not leave it with the other chute he didn't use?

I'm a little confused how nobody followed up speaking with Emrick about the chute itself. he's the one who gave the FBI the chute, but very little coverage of him can be found? why hasn't anyone attempted to contact him? if he missed it, why can't another miss it?

everyone talks about the butts for DNA. how about the hair samples?

also found this interesting?
« Last Edit: April 29, 2017, 09:52:00 PM by Shutter »
 

Offline Bruce A. Smith

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1639 on: April 30, 2017, 04:43:39 AM »
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everyone talks about the butts for DNA. how about the hair samples?


Ayn Dietrich-Williams told me that the FBI collected hair samples off the head rest linen. GG said the same thing.

But then GG said the feds got their samples when they pulled the seats at Quantico, the day after the hijacking, which is not supported by the documentation that GG have us in his first big file, which said the 305 went to Boeing Field in Seattle to get repaired on the day after T-Day.
 

Offline Shutter

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1640 on: April 30, 2017, 10:57:18 AM »
I'm wondering what happened to the hair samples, and did they try to obtain DNA from them?

Did they lose the towel, micro slide, and the butts? they were all sent back to Vegas at the same time?
« Last Edit: April 30, 2017, 11:28:37 AM by Shutter »
 

georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1641 on: April 30, 2017, 03:54:49 PM »
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I'm wondering what happened to the hair samples, and did they try to obtain DNA from them?

Did they lose the towel, micro slide, and the butts? they were all sent back to Vegas at the same time?

There can be only one explanation: Satanism.  >:D
 

Offline Kermit

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1642 on: April 30, 2017, 03:55:56 PM »
I am pretty new here but thanks to a number of forum members here, I have enjoyed getting up to speed on a lot of topics. What i find funny to some extent is after watching several video, these FBI agents seem to know exactly who DBC was and what he was thinking! REALLY ? He almost certainly was a unintelligent disgruntled ex serviceman who lost his job and had no plan ..... Yada. Yada .. blah blah blah ! Yet in reality they have been unable to solve any aspect of this puzzle. I guess if you can't solve the caper, let's just discredit it !
 

georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1643 on: April 30, 2017, 04:39:11 PM »
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I am pretty new here but thanks to a number of forum members here, I have enjoyed getting up to speed on a lot of topics. What i find funny to some extent is after watching several video, these FBI agents seem to know exactly who DBC was and what he was thinking! REALLY ? He almost certainly was a unintelligent disgruntled ex serviceman who lost his job and had no plan ..... Yada. Yada .. blah blah blah ! Yet in reality they have been unable to solve any aspect of this puzzle. I guess if you can't solve the caper, let's just discredit it !

Well the hijacking like most in this era, occur in a period of massive unrest nationally and globally. So the context is clear whatever value judgement you assume about Cooper himself. By his own lips Cooper was trying to right a wrong whether personal or something else. If he survived, he had the brains not to surface afterwards milking the incident further - saying "here I am suckers, come and get me!". And so far as we know he conducted no further hijackings? There seems to have come a point where the FBI was willing to let this "lone hijacker" go. There's a lot we dont know but as I see it the case has been essentially closed since 1980 when the excavation failed to turn up any "biologicals" (FBI assessment) at Tina Bar. The FBI and others may have made an assessment they probably wouldnt be hearing anything further from this "lone assassin" so let the case go pending anything else surfacing?

It's apparently in this context that evidence is lost or misplaced or not kept track of, with no apparent urgency to sequester all of the evidence into one central holding location pending future developments, which would be SOP for any high profile case. To date not even the high profile investors "GG" "TK" "TC" and the like, who have working relationships with the FBI, have been able to penetrate that mystery box or they surely would have said something adding to their fame and glory ... instead the whole matter sits like a frog-on-a-log sunning itself for any idiot who wants to pontificate and extrapolate with impunity, milking the void for all it can give on the "Ghost to Ghost Show"!

Meanwhile, nobody has actually been able to prove that the FBI/NWA account of the flight path is wrong! That raises the question of how Cooper money could have come to Tina Bar! One strong contender is: that Cooper survived which is the last thing the FBI wants to hear! (And most private investigators likewise because it only expands the scope of looking for a needle in a haystack).

Cooper himself told Tina he had been waiting for the 'right plane in the right place on the right day' so it's clear he not only had a plan but he also had some sense of the "scope" of the search it might take to locate him, after the fact. I remember people saying at the time: "we may never find this guy - the scope of this thing is just too large".

Whoever Cooper was, and whatever the facts are, he might as well have gone to a Galaxy Far Away! Interference from the public would turn out to be one of the dimensions in this case = something the public itself has participated in forming. And the names on that list are as clear as daylight! The case itself turned out to be as big an illusion as Cooper himself! Here one moment, gone the next. That's the stuff legends and religions are founded on; claims of miracles.  It's fertile ground for conspiracy makers. C:-)   

   
« Last Edit: April 30, 2017, 04:55:46 PM by georger »
 
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Offline Kermit

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1644 on: April 30, 2017, 05:20:01 PM »
Maybe it's just me but I'm not sold on the theory that he had some kind of bone to pick or vendetta. The loot amounted to over a $1,200,000 in today's value,so I'm going with he did it for the $$$$$$$. Lol there are so many people who are stating he worked for NWA or Boeing and was fired or something. REALLY ?  Let's see now how this goes. Cooper works for Boeing which in 1971 is located barely 10 miles from SeaTac. He thinks this will work because nobody from there will know who I am or recognize me ? Not very logical to me ! Or perhaps he got fired by NWA and once again .... nobody would know or recognize me ! I guess I'll just stick with the he $$$$ as a motive.
 

georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1645 on: April 30, 2017, 05:54:46 PM »
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Maybe it's just me but I'm not sold on the theory that he had some kind of bone to pick or vendetta. The loot amounted to over a $1,200,000 in today's value,so I'm going with he did it for the $$$$$$$. Lol there are so many people who are stating he worked for NWA or Boeing and was fired or something. REALLY ?  Let's see now how this goes. Cooper works for Boeing which in 1971 is located barely 10 miles from SeaTac. He thinks this will work because nobody from there will know who I am or recognize me ? Not very logical to me ! Or perhaps he got fired by NWA and once again .... nobody would know or recognize me ! I guess I'll just stick with the he $$$$ as a motive.

Most FBI people think its about money. And they agree with your logic of him not working at NWA or Boeing, in fact he said (told Tina) this had nothing to do with NWA ("your airlines"). He stated "airlines" plural not 'airline' when referring to NWA, which may be a clue to his level of understanding. Carr was sure it had to do with money vs political. Given his age its a high probability he had some military background, WWII or Korea or maybe even Vietnam? He seemed comfortable with the idea of jumping and with chutes and working with chutes. He strikes me as a loner looking for an opportunity (and easy for him personally).  :)     

I hope you are able to put an eyeball on where the placard landed and mate up with some people who knew the finders.
« Last Edit: April 30, 2017, 06:00:01 PM by georger »
 
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Offline Kermit

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1646 on: April 30, 2017, 06:07:49 PM »
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Maybe it's just me but I'm not sold on the theory that he had some kind of bone to pick or vendetta. The loot amounted to over a $1,200,000 in today's value,so I'm going with he did it for the $$$$$$$. Lol there are so many people who are stating he worked for NWA or Boeing and was fired or something. REALLY ?  Let's see now how this goes. Cooper works for Boeing which in 1971 is located barely 10 miles from SeaTac. He thinks this will work because nobody from there will know who I am or recognize me ? Not very logical to me ! Or perhaps he got fired by NWA and once again .... nobody would know or recognize me ! I guess I'll just stick with the he $$$$ as a motive.

Most FBI people think its about money. And they agree with your logic of him not working at NWA or Boeing, in fact he said (told Tina) this had nothing to do with NWA ("your airlines"). He stated "airlines" plural not 'airline' when referring to NWA, which may be a clue to his level of understanding. Carr was sure it had to do with money vs political. Given his age its a high probability he had some military background, WWII or Korea or maybe even Vietnam? He seemed comfortable with the idea of jumping and with chutes and working with chutes. He strikes me as a loner looking for an opportunity (and easy for him personally).  :)     

I hope you are able to put an eyeball on where the placard landed and mate up with some people who knew the finders.
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Maybe it's just me but I'm not sold on the theory that he had some kind of bone to pick or vendetta. The loot amounted to over a $1,200,000 in today's value,so I'm going with he did it for the $$$$$$$. Lol there are so many people who are stating he worked for NWA or Boeing and was fired or something. REALLY ?  Let's see now how this goes. Cooper works for Boeing which in 1971 is located barely 10 miles from SeaTac. He thinks this will work because nobody from there will know who I am or recognize me ? Not very logical to me ! Or perhaps he got fired by NWA and once again .... nobody would know or recognize me ! I guess I'll just stick with the he $$$$ as a motive.

Most FBI people think its about money. And they agree with your logic of him not working at NWA or Boeing, in fact he said (told Tina) this had nothing to do with NWA ("your airlines"). He stated "airlines" plural not 'airline' when referring to NWA, which may be a clue to his level of understanding. Carr was sure it had to do with money vs political. Given his age its a high probability he had some military background, WWII or Korea or maybe even Vietnam? He seemed comfortable with the idea of jumping and with chutes and working with chutes. He strikes me as a loner looking for an opportunity (and easy for him personally).  :)     

I hope you are able to put an eyeball on where the placard landed and mate up with some people who knew the finders.

Now we are on the same page. I love logical people !
 

Robert99

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1647 on: April 30, 2017, 07:04:13 PM »
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Maybe it's just me but I'm not sold on the theory that he had some kind of bone to pick or vendetta. The loot amounted to over a $1,200,000 in today's value,so I'm going with he did it for the $$$$$$$. Lol there are so many people who are stating he worked for NWA or Boeing and was fired or something. REALLY ?  Let's see now how this goes. Cooper works for Boeing which in 1971 is located barely 10 miles from SeaTac. He thinks this will work because nobody from there will know who I am or recognize me ? Not very logical to me ! Or perhaps he got fired by NWA and once again .... nobody would know or recognize me ! I guess I'll just stick with the he $$$$ as a motive.

Most FBI people think its about money. And they agree with your logic of him not working at NWA or Boeing, in fact he said (told Tina) this had nothing to do with NWA ("your airlines"). He stated "airlines" plural not 'airline' when referring to NWA, which may be a clue to his level of understanding. Carr was sure it had to do with money vs political. Given his age its a high probability he had some military background, WWII or Korea or maybe even Vietnam? He seemed comfortable with the idea of jumping and with chutes and working with chutes. He strikes me as a loner looking for an opportunity (and easy for him personally).  :)     

I hope you are able to put an eyeball on where the placard landed and mate up with some people who knew the finders.
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
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Maybe it's just me but I'm not sold on the theory that he had some kind of bone to pick or vendetta. The loot amounted to over a $1,200,000 in today's value,so I'm going with he did it for the $$$$$$$. Lol there are so many people who are stating he worked for NWA or Boeing and was fired or something. REALLY ?  Let's see now how this goes. Cooper works for Boeing which in 1971 is located barely 10 miles from SeaTac. He thinks this will work because nobody from there will know who I am or recognize me ? Not very logical to me ! Or perhaps he got fired by NWA and once again .... nobody would know or recognize me ! I guess I'll just stick with the he $$$$ as a motive.

Most FBI people think its about money. And they agree with your logic of him not working at NWA or Boeing, in fact he said (told Tina) this had nothing to do with NWA ("your airlines"). He stated "airlines" plural not 'airline' when referring to NWA, which may be a clue to his level of understanding. Carr was sure it had to do with money vs political. Given his age its a high probability he had some military background, WWII or Korea or maybe even Vietnam? He seemed comfortable with the idea of jumping and with chutes and working with chutes. He strikes me as a loner looking for an opportunity (and easy for him personally).  :)     

I hope you are able to put an eyeball on where the placard landed and mate up with some people who knew the finders.

Now we are on the same page. I love logical people !

Personally, I believe that he was probably a former military type, and perhaps had some experience in extra-military operations.  By that, I mean he may have had experience working as a contractor or sub-contractor for the US or maybe a company such as Boeing.

Let me remind you that the entire west coast from Seattle to San Diego was heavily impacted by the slow down of the aviation industry in the early 1970s.  Kermit can probably correct me on this, but I think Boeing laid off about 40,000 or 50,000 direct employees in the Seattle area at that time.  And there were probably also thousands of "job shop" type contractors that were also laid off then, plus the usual vendors and suppliers.

I knew quite a few west coast technical types who were adversely impacted by that slow down.  And not all of them were happy campers.  However, Cooper does not look like anybody I ever knew.

I also feel that Cooper did it for the money.     
« Last Edit: May 01, 2017, 01:34:22 AM by Robert99 »
 
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Offline Kermit

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1648 on: April 30, 2017, 07:55:02 PM »
Robert is 100% correct about the widespread layoffs at Boeing. However I seriously doubt he worked for Boeing although I see why people make the jump. Once again Boeing is like 10 miles from SeaTac and the massive layoffs had happened shortly before the highjacking. I'll buy into the Ex military theory but not exclusively as way too many options.
 

georger

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Re: Clues, Documents And Evidence About The Case
« Reply #1649 on: April 30, 2017, 11:35:38 PM »
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Robert is 100% correct about the widespread layoffs at Boeing. However I seriously doubt he worked for Boeing although I see why people make the jump. Once again Boeing is like 10 miles from SeaTac and the massive layoffs had happened shortly before the highjacking. I'll buy into the Ex military theory but not exclusively as way too many options.

Too many options may be one reason he was never traced? That's why physical evidence was so important. The FBI allowed Kaye to do his tests - now if they will just allow others (like forensic geneticists) to get involved. It might turn this around... 
« Last Edit: April 30, 2017, 11:36:55 PM by georger »